homemade recovery point - Page 6





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  1. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dapper Muis View Post
    I have spoken to a salesman at 4x4 megaworld.
    He suggested that I fit a pin tow bal fitting (as per the picture below).
    He assured me that it would be strong enough as a recovery point.
    Putting the snatch strap thought the pin and locking it in place.

    Can somebody please confirm this for me before I spend the money?
    Arguments against it?

    The advantages I see is that it is in the middle of the vehicle. (eliminating using a bridle)
    Easily accessible when the vehicle is in mud.

    http://www.4x4community.co.za/forum/...1&d=1259141464
    Hmmm...... let the argueing begin!
    Overkill - isn't!

  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Uys View Post
    Hmmm...... let the argueing begin!
    Not quite what I had in mind.
    I understood that the argument against using the tow ball for recoveries was that the ball broke and became a missile.

    A straight YES you can or NO that is dangerous would work for me.

  3. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dapper Muis View Post
    Not quite what I had in mind.
    I understood that the argument against using the tow ball for recoveries was that the ball broke and became a missile.

    A straight YES you can or NO that is dangerous would work for me.
    No!

    (The hitch might hold, but the tow bar not).

  4. #104
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    Thank you 4ePajero.
    I will get recovery points made up and bolted to the chassis.

  5. #105
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    Dapper Muis

    I think the main issue with that tow-ball would be the direction in which the bolts are attached to the chassis.
    If you can imagine that the bolts would be in the same direction as the pull of the recovery rope. In this manner, you are relying upon the thread for strength. This is much less desirable than having bolts running perpendicular to the angle of pull, in which you have the strength of the actual bolt.

  6. #106
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    Bolts are stronger in tension than in sheer, so that's not the problem. The problem is the structure behind the recovery pin, which is often 2 thin walled pipes with attachment points only on the chassis. A violent pull in the middle of the towbar will break it. Some towbars can handle those farces and have some extra bracing, but some can't.

  7. #107
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    I recently saw a recovery, which really opened my eyes to these threads ......

    Vehicle got hung up (beached) on a sand mount. Just a gentle tug would be enough to get the vehicle off.

    BUT, .....always a BUT ......

    The only available place for a recovery was at 30 to 40 degree with the line of the vehicle. Immediately putting all kinds of "strange" loads on the recovery points - a towbar is definately not designed for such sideways thrusts.

    The first recovery went fine.

    The second time another vehicle did the recovery. What ever the reason this vehicle was not able to apply a "gentle tug" (as the first vehicle did), next he reversed, lined up and did what I can only describe as a snatch recovery with a standard strap .....

    Can this be correct ?? It really looked dangerous to me.

  8. #108
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    That's really dumb and dangerous.

    That's why I say, start with your snatch strap and only use the tow strap to extend the snatch strap. With the necessary safety measures in place when you hook up the snatch strap, you can use your snatch strap to just gently tow a vehicle, or you already have everything set up to then snatch if towing doesn't work.

  9. #109
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dapper Muis View Post
    I have spoken to a salesman at 4x4 megaworld.
    He suggested that I fit a pin tow bal fitting (as per the picture below).
    He assured me that it would be strong enough as a recovery point.
    Putting the snatch strap thought the pin and locking it in place.

    Can somebody please confirm this for me before I spend the money?
    Arguments against it?

    The advantages I see is that it is in the middle of the vehicle. (eliminating using a bridle)
    Easily accessible when the vehicle is in mud.

    http://www.4x4community.co.za/forum/...1&d=1259141464
    That thing is more than strong enough, as long as you have a solid towbar (nonremovable drop plate). If you have the Mopar removable towbar, simply remove the ball from the "receiver mount" (see pic below) and attach your bow shackle through the hole were the ball usualy bolts through. If you have a detachable drop plate, buy one of this type of receiver mounts, which you use when "wheeling" as the Yanks call it.



    I would love to do this, but the idjit that had the GC before me have the removable part welded on permanently, because he could not handle the noise when towing. I now have a permanent plow attached to my car

  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zantus View Post
    Bolts are stronger in tension than in sheer, so that's not the problem. The problem is the structure behind the recovery pin, which is often 2 thin walled pipes with attachment points only on the chassis. A violent pull in the middle of the towbar will break it. Some towbars can handle those farces and have some extra bracing, but some can't.
    I run a pin setup on the back as well as the front. But I have to add that I use 8.8 x 14mm bolts to hold them in place. Both the mounting points are reinforced with 12mm Bennox plate.

    I am also in the process of fitting 2 x recovery hooks on the front and 2 x recovery hooks on the back. The idea is to use my "tree protector" as a bridle type of setup to make sure that the ball and pin setup, can't be a missile.
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  11. #111
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    Ebot, you need to know tha when you pull anyting, the bigger the pull; the bigger the force. from an engeneering point of view (not that im one , but knolegeable), pull hard enough, and the trhead WILL tear of its host. bigger threts are best.

  12. #112
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    just remember; the smaler the thret ,the less power AKA torque, you can exequte on a shaft. keep the thred thick and pull a bull out of a well.

  13. #113
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    Just a question that I want to pose to you. I agree that using a tow hitch is a bad idea when recovering a vehicle. and tying the snatch strap to the bull bar is even dumber as I've seen bullbars come off. Tell me if I'm doing it wrong but I loop the snatch strap around the chassis and then put it through a shackle . thus elimanating the need for a recovery point. I used to do that all the time with my hilux front and back. my nissan hardbody has a recovery point that I have used succesfully for snatches. I did once experience a land cruiser so badly stuck that we attached another cruiser and my defender to its factory fitted tow hitch and pulled with both vehicles at the same time till the snatch straps pulled our vehicles back. the tow hitch did not break lucky for us.
    That was stupid and I had not learnt alot at that time yet. since then I always loop the snatch around the chassi somewhere.

  14. #114
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    That is fine as long as the chassis doesn't have any sharp edges that will cut the strap and it doesn't get pinched by the shackle.

    The ideal would be to attach a much stronger strap to the chassis, something like a tree trunk protector and then attach the snatch strap to that.

    As always, a safety strap onto the snatch strap is highly recommended.

  15. #115
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    will that slow down a tow hitch thats flying through the air. I had another look at my nissans recovery oint in the front and i looks pretty interesting I think they used there heads there. I'll take a pic later.

  16. #116
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    Rather stay away from the tow hitch, the risk is just too high that it might break.

    Any recovery point can still fail since you cannot accurately test and rate them. So even if you think you have a really strong recovery point, that extra bit of effort to attach a safety strap won't kill you....in fact, not doing it might kill you

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by OwenD View Post
    aaah! hrmmm...will investigate that too!
    So Owen, what was the outcome of your recovery point?
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  18. #118
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    aaah very good question...

    well the outcome was - er, interesting.

    Because I am a mechanical retard after all that measuring and double checking and drawings and measuring some more I managed to drill the holes too far apart from each other.

    But interestingly enough this failure of being a man offered a solution to my worries about the rig applying too much pivot force on the chassis rail and being a glorified in situ pipe bender.

    Because I wanted the bolts to be tight against the top and bottom of the chassis, and they were now about 10mm too far away, this gave me the opportunity to insert a length of 10mm plate between the upper bolts and the chassis member which effectively spreads any pivot load over a greater surface area and reduces the potential for damage. heres a picture of what I am talking about...



    before i got around to doing that i had to do a very mild recovery of a friends polo that had tried its luck on a sand track near his beach house. So it was not a snatch by our standards because he obviously just had the factory front towing eye hook and I did not want to rip it out, but my recovery point did not even move the slightest bit





    I am getting some bumpers made up as we speak with proper recovery points so i will not have to rely on this for much longer, but because it is portable i will be attaching it to any one of the universities bakkies that I find myself having to take out for the day because none of them have any points on and i think its better than nothing

    So as a temporary point that you can easily transfer to separate vehicles i think it is ideal, but if i was not getting my bumpers i would look for something more permanent.

    After seeing just how tight it is around the chassis and how it does not move I decided against adding the bolt in the centre drilled through the chassis because my feeling is that the squeezing/friction force between the drop plates and the chassis is high enough to stop it moving around on there even on energetic recoveries.

    I will do a more vigorous recovery with it and post some pictures to see how it holds out
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  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThysleRoux View Post
    That thing is more than strong enough, as long as you have a solid towbar (nonremovable drop plate). If you have the Mopar removable towbar, simply remove the ball from the "receiver mount" (see pic below) and attach your bow shackle through the hole were the ball usualy bolts through. If you have a detachable drop plate, buy one of this type of receiver mounts, which you use when "wheeling" as the Yanks call it.



    I would love to do this, but the idjit that had the GC before me have the removable part welded on permanently, because he could not handle the noise when towing. I now have a permanent plow attached to my car
    Keep in mind that the Mopar tow bar is not the same as a class 3 which the above receiver mount is meant for. The mopar uses a smaller receiver opening. which I don't trust for recoveries. The pin is the weakest point in that setup.

    I've got the larger hitch with a heavier rating than mopar, but I still prefer to use the recovery points instead of the tow-hitch.
    If you don't have a sense of humour, you probably don't have any sense.

  20. #120
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    So after all of that.....

    Quote Originally Posted by OwenD View Post
    I am getting some bumpers made up as we speak with proper recovery points
    It's the path we all end up taking..... eventially!

    BTW - without any scientific numbers - my gut feel - that recovery point is not going anywhere - it may move or shift, but it's not coming off.
    Wade Bowman
    '07 Land Cruiser 76 SW
    '08 Discovery 3 V6TD HSE
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