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  1. #1
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    Default GV not able to ride dunes?

    I was out on the dunes this weekend and had a few serious issues with my GV
    1) The TC really battled with axle tramp corrugations from previous vehicles on the run up to a dune. When accelerating, the TC slammed on and off so hard I could not get up enough speed to crest the dune. Going slowly over them was not an option, as the run up was then too short.
    2) I accidently left the handbrake up for a short period, and the TC stopped working. Overheating from the brakes can cause this? It came back after about 5 minutes.
    3) Some dunes needed high range first gear. I switched the ESP off, but as soon as I hit 40 km/h, it switched back on, and turning sharply for the dune, the ESP cut the power, slowing me to a crawl. Is the ESP supposed to switch on at this speed?
    4) Reversing up a dune to get a run up, as the wheels spun, the TC and ABS caused the brake pedal to go rock hard, and I could not brake to stop on the slope, but rolled downhill. If there had been a vehicle, or god forbid, somebody in front of me, I would have hit him.

    On the hard stuff, I have had no issues, and the TC impressed me tremendously, but on bumpy sand, there appears to be major issues.
    Has anybody experienced similar problems?
    Glen

  2. #2
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    Default

    Never been on that type of terrain. But everything you explain makes sense with the TC. JNel knows of a way to turn it off completely - I need to know as well it seems.
    2015 Isuzu KB250 D/C 4x4 HO LE - Mine / 2009 Suzuki Grand Vitara 3.2l V6 Auto - Hers



  3. #3
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    Default

    Whilst I'm not totally familiar with a Vitara's TC set-up, I can say that they go ok in sand. Especially the V6.

    A common thing that I experience is that new sand drivers complain about the traction control coming in whilst storming a dune, when in fact it is actually the rev limiter that being used when maxing out in a particular gear. The solution is to use the revs in such a way that its just below the limiter. So use less throttle & you'll actually go further.

    Try to stay out of high range because the clutch doesn't like it. 1st high is commonly used but only when you need revs, not torque. Also, don't reverse too hard up a dune. It can ruin your axle.

    ABS is a pain so try not to brake :-). Floor it instead & use rev limited as a brake.

  4. #4
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    Thanks Neil
    I have 15 years sand riding experience in an open diff 4X4 (when the beaches were open, from PE to the Moz border for fishing) , but this TC and ABS seems to realy mess me around in the bumpy sandy stuff.
    Smooth sand is no issue. I can launch ski boats and the TC does not even kick in, but on the dunes when there are these corrugations, the TC (or me) seems to get horribly confused. Maybe I just need to learn a new technique?
    I suppose thats why we practise?
    Glen
    Last edited by elliotgr; 2013/07/14 at 11:44 PM. Reason: spellling
    Glen

  5. #5
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    Default

    Just a thought - is there perhaps a fuse that can be removed to disable the electronics on demand? Don't know if it will be practical though...
    Jeep GC WK2 - 3.6L - 8-speed

  6. #6
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    I found this, but am wary to try until the warranty expires

    Disabling ESP and TC

    http://www.suzuki-forums.com/2g-2006...i-think-5.html
    Glen

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by elliotgr View Post
    I was out on the dunes this weekend and had a few serious issues with my GV
    1) The TC really battled with axle tramp corrugations from previous vehicles on the run up to a dune. When accelerating, the TC slammed on and off so hard I could not get up enough speed to crest the dune. Going slowly over them was not an option, as the run up was then too short.
    2) I accidently left the handbrake up for a short period, and the TC stopped working. Overheating from the brakes can cause this? It came back after about 5 minutes.
    3) Some dunes needed high range first gear. I switched the ESP off, but as soon as I hit 40 km/h, it switched back on, and turning sharply for the dune, the ESP cut the power, slowing me to a crawl. Is the ESP supposed to switch on at this speed?
    4) Reversing up a dune to get a run up, as the wheels spun, the TC and ABS caused the brake pedal to go rock hard, and I could not brake to stop on the slope, but rolled downhill. If there had been a vehicle, or god forbid, somebody in front of me, I would have hit him.

    On the hard stuff, I have had no issues, and the TC impressed me tremendously, but on bumpy sand, there appears to be major issues.
    Has anybody experienced similar problems?
    Why not simply drive in low range. ESP (but not brake traction control) switches off in low range. Low range 2/3 should give you similar ratios than 1st in 4H.

    As per the manual page 3-35: "when the transfer switch is turned to '4L LOCK' ESP systems will be turned off to privide improved vehicle traction and the ESP OFF indicator light will come on..."

    It may solve half your problem if you drive dunes in low range.
    Jeep GC WK2 - 3.6L - 8-speed

  8. #8
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    Also depends on tyres & pressure. RT tyres spin out quicker enabling the TC systems. Lowering the pressure more is an immediate solution with road tyres. TC then becomes less invasive.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by elliotgr View Post

    4) Reversing up a dune to get a run up, as the wheels spun, the TC and ABS caused the brake pedal to go rock hard, and I could not brake to stop on the slope, but rolled downhill. If there had been a vehicle, or god forbid, somebody in front of me, I would have hit him.
    same thing happen to me long time ago,and on camera.
    when everything else fails there is THE HANDBRAKE.
    look from -+ 1 minute onwards.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StzlVgu52F8

  10. #10
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    Default

    While in the dunes with a Prado 150 the guys messed up the road with their traction control too.. They would have a nice smooth ride but leave mayor corrugations for the rest to follow in.. their system added them but when it got really hairy they too turned it off with good results.. Surely there must be some way to disengage completely.. Owners manual?


    1990 Toyota Hilux - In process..
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  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by elliotgr View Post
    I found this, but am wary to try until the warranty expires

    Disabling ESP and TC

    http://www.suzuki-forums.com/2g-2006...i-think-5.html
    Ok so who's going to be the guinea pig? I would try this but maybe its better for someone with GV out of warranty period

  12. #12
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    Good news and bad news.
    Somewhere on this forum somebody discovered if you switch the ESP off in 4 H-lock and before you drive, switch to 4 low, the TC is disabled. (obviously the ESP is forced off in 4 low).
    I proved this today by getting into an axle twister and the TC did NOT kick in irrespective of revs

    Now the bad news.....

    I then did the above again, but before tackling the axle twister, I went over 30 km/h in 4 low (where in 4 H lock the ESP automatically enables again).
    Then trying the axle twister again, the TC was active.

    So what we have is:-
    1) AWD
    2) 4 H lock ESP and TC enabled permanently.
    3) 4 H lock ESP disabled until 30 km/h is reached when it enables. TC enabled permanently.
    4) 4 L lock ESP disabled permanently and TC enabled permanently.
    5) 4 L lock ESP disabled permanently and TC disabled until 30 km/h is reached when TC enables

    Each will have its own uses.
    Keen to try the TC disabled in 4 L in sand (so long as I don't go 30 km/h)
    Glen

  13. #13
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by elliotgr View Post
    ...so long as I don't go 30 km/h
    That bit is the problem...
    2015 Isuzu KB250 D/C 4x4 HO LE - Mine / 2009 Suzuki Grand Vitara 3.2l V6 Auto - Hers



  14. #14
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    Back in the sand, and purposely got stuck in 4 L with TC on. Switched off the TC as mentioned above, and spun the wheels to get out. Worked perfectly except I had the window open.......
    Glen

  15. #15
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    Default

    Hey guys,

    In light of the above may i ask a few questions?

    I am a huge fan of the Kgalagadi and often head of to their "remote" 4X4 only camps. To get to these sites one must undertake a offroad dune path. I did this last year easily in my TD5 Discovery and didnt even venture into low range - these aren't the most hectic off roads.

    Can someone enlighten me in the best way to drive a petrol auto GV? I understand there are very different techniques with a petrol engine and im not clear on the best way to use the autobox. i know very often one would pull off in 3 H so that there wasnt too much torque on the wheels. How does one do this in an auto?

    Thanks for the assistance in advance!
    2013 Suzuki Grand Vitara Summit Auto

    Ex: 2004 Land Rovery Discovery 2 TD5
    Ex: 1996 Suzuki Samurai

  16. #16
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    The GV allows you to pull off in second gear.

    Press the A/T Power button - you'll see a light on the dash.
    Select 2nd gear.
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  17. #17
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    ok Saxj, Thanks.

    Any other tips...
    2013 Suzuki Grand Vitara Summit Auto

    Ex: 2004 Land Rovery Discovery 2 TD5
    Ex: 1996 Suzuki Samurai

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sammy'96 View Post
    ok Saxj, Thanks.

    Any other tips...
    Well, the principles of sand driving remains the same: Momentum and tire pressure...

    The traction control may make maintaining momentum slightly more complicated but it should be easier to manage with the auto (vs. manual).

    Low profile tires may make running low tire pressures less feasible.

    http://www.outbackcrossing.com.au/Fo..._0n_Sand.shtml
    Last edited by NS406; 2013/08/08 at 12:54 PM. Reason: link
    Jeep GC WK2 - 3.6L - 8-speed

  19. #19
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    Thanks NS406 super useful link!

    I guess im more referring to the techniques of a auto. How invasive is the TC?
    2013 Suzuki Grand Vitara Summit Auto

    Ex: 2004 Land Rovery Discovery 2 TD5
    Ex: 1996 Suzuki Samurai

  20. #20
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    I found the fix. I used the trick mentioned in one of the posts above to switch off the TC in 4L. Getting the wheels spinning in the sand prevents the TC kicking in, even if you go above 30 km/h. I tackled a difficult climb a few times, using the same run up distance, and various combinations of 4 wheel drive, ESP and TC. I could only get up using 4L without TC, and it did it fairly easy, while in the other modes, I got stuck 3/4 of the way up.
    Glen

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