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  1. #1
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    Default checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Hi all
    The PO of my vehicle has done a fairly heafty lift but looking at some of the workmanship and corner cutting I doubt he checked the caster correction. The handeling is good ( compaired to my old series 2 LR) but has got a little "loose" on one or two ocasions. Now, I resently had the back springs replaced and they have not setteled yet, so will this afffect the caster if they measure it, and should I load up a bag or two of cement and sand at the back to a level which i think it should be at while it gets checked
    Shout if this does not make sense please

    G

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  3. #2
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Reduced caster will cause the car to "wander" more. Note sure if that is what you are describing as "loose".

    I think the rear would have to be weighed down quite a lot to make any significant difference to the caster angle, but too lazy to try working it out right now.
    Beat-up rat rod of a '96 Nissan Patrol that bears the evidence of many wonderful adventures (and a few stupid indiscretions).

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  5. #3
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Easiest would be to get it checked on a wheel alignment machine. As peter says negative caster causes steering issues and makes your steering wheel feel "jumpy", this happens after a big lift with no corrective measures put in place.

    Loading up the rear should not make much of a difference when they check.
    Walter aka "Meerkat"
    slightly modded 02' 105 series 1FZ-FE
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  7. #4
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Peter is correct. The ass would have to way down before it affects caster.....although Bfreesani is the expert on how not to do it.
    Jakes Louw
    2012 Jeep Sahara Unlimited 3.6 V6
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  8. #5
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Why the lift without caster correction ?
    Jakes Louw
    2012 Jeep Sahara Unlimited 3.6 V6
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Can a 70 series caster be adjusted?

  10. #7
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Peter is correct. The ass would have to way down before it affects caster.....although Bfreesani is the expert on how not to do it.
    Um ja. Big lift will get those arms sitting at an angle. Bigger droop causes bigger angle. Experience I had after that, by loading the backside, casued the nose to lift more, increasing the angle even more. And even worse when I hooked up a heavily loaded trailer. Rather disappointed with the radias arms in this respect. A flat radias arm works well from that point on, but when you start off with an angle, its a whole different story. Probably one of the reasons why the Yanks go 3 or 4 link as soon as they lift thier Jeeps. Just so much easier controlling castor.
    David/Hillbilly - 1997 SFA Nissan Sani 2,7 TD - 5" lift on 33" tires - Dual Transfer with 4.1 gears

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  11. #8
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by GarethHAllen View Post
    Can a 70 series caster be adjusted?
    Any radius Arm can be corrected.
    Jakes Louw
    2012 Jeep Sahara Unlimited 3.6 V6
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    https://youtu.be/oWr2OnFBEA8 found this after a quick search.

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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Why the lift without caster correction ?
    Usually caster correction etc is only done when lifting more than 2". At least on SFA.
    Walter aka "Meerkat"
    slightly modded 02' 105 series 1FZ-FE
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  15. #11
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by AboutAfrica View Post
    Usually caster correction etc is only done when lifting more than 2". At least on SFA.
    Indeed. We don't know what was done here and why.
    Jakes Louw
    2012 Jeep Sahara Unlimited 3.6 V6
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  16. #12
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by bfreesani View Post
    Um ja. Big lift will get those arms sitting at an angle. Bigger droop causes bigger angle. Experience I had after that, by loading the backside, casued the nose to lift more, increasing the angle even more. And even worse when I hooked up a heavily loaded trailer. Rather disappointed with the radias arms in this respect. A flat radias arm works well from that point on, but when you start off with an angle, its a whole different story. Probably one of the reasons why the Yanks go 3 or 4 link as soon as they lift thier Jeeps. Just so much easier controlling castor.
    There is nothing worst than a 3 link suspension

  17. #13
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gengis View Post
    Hi all
    The PO of my vehicle has done a fairly heafty lift but looking at some of the workmanship and corner cutting I doubt he checked the caster correction. The handeling is good ( compaired to my old series 2 LR) but has got a little "loose" on one or two ocasions. Now, I resently had the back springs replaced and they have not setteled yet, so will this afffect the caster if they measure it, and should I load up a bag or two of cement and sand at the back to a level which i think it should be at while it gets checked
    Shout if this does not make sense please

    G
    The only accurate way is to strip off a knuckle. Then make a pin to go through the nuckle kingpins and measure with inclinometer. Radius arm angles are critic.

    On the Cruiser you do get aftermarket castor corrected radius arms or radius arm correction bushes.

    Sommer a silly question. Do you have spacers at the back. If not this could be the cause of the wandering issue.

    But then I do not know much about this stuff
    Last edited by grips; 2020/09/29 at 08:59 PM.

  18. #14
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    LC70 all have them
    Quote Originally Posted by grips View Post
    There is nothing worst than a 3 link suspension
    Jakes Louw
    2012 Jeep Sahara Unlimited 3.6 V6
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  19. #15
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by bfreesani View Post
    Um ja. Big lift will get those arms sitting at an angle. Bigger droop causes bigger angle. Experience I had after that, by loading the backside, casued the nose to lift more, increasing the angle even more. And even worse when I hooked up a heavily loaded trailer. Rather disappointed with the radias arms in this respect. A flat radias arm works well from that point on, but when you start off with an angle, its a whole different story. Probably one of the reasons why the Yanks go 3 or 4 link as soon as they lift thier Jeeps. Just so much easier controlling castor.
    Castor on stock 3 link suspension vehicles is controlled by the movement allowed on the rear suspension. The rear will hit the stoppers within the front castor limits. Lift the vehicle and everything goes haywire.

    Three links with lifts beyond 2" will cause crabbing. You will need adjustable panhard
    rods from day one.

    As easy as it seems three link calculations are beyond most DIY builders
    Last edited by grips; 2020/09/29 at 09:25 PM.

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  21. #16
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    LC70 all have them
    I know, I have two Cruisers

  22. #17
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    It depends on how one counts the links, i guess. The panard link is only there to correct left right movement. So essentialy they are a two link system where the iinks also control ( prevent)the axel rotation. As Gripps said not ideal, probally quite cheap to make but also bloody strong, and we all know that it works. I will go as far as saying ( popcorn anyone) that this is the main reason why our 70's and not permanent 4 wheel drive. They would have had endless UJ and diff problems and noise from the continiously changeing diff angle, not really an issue ( or masked by) off road. Anyway , it's wot we got and it works. Now measuring the castor angle on a vechile standing still , with a digital level, it will change depending on the rear hight. I'm not sure by how much or if it matters, but it will change if the arce is up high or loaded down. Reletive to the chassis the castor will remain the same, but at the alignment garage, they check it using all 4 wheels as a referance, not the chassis. So if you went there with new rear springs and no load, the measured caster angle would be different to if you were fully loaded ready for a trip. Again, buy how much, and does it make a differance.
    I'm still thinking a a simulated average load in the rear while getting it checked especialy with a slightly higher rear end due to new springs.

  23. #18
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gengis View Post
    I will go as far as saying ( popcorn anyone) that this is the main reason why our 70's and not permanent 4 wheel drive. They would have had endless UJ and diff problems and noise from the continiously changeing diff angle, not really an issue ( or masked by) off road.
    The following permanent 4WD vehicles have conceptually identical three-link system in the front, and some even front and rear:
    80-series cruisers (those which have permanent 4WD)
    105-series cruisers
    Range Rover (all the live-axle models)
    Land Rover 90/110/Defender (all live axle models)
    Land Rover Discovery 1 and 2 (front and rear)
    Mercedes Gelandewagen (all the live-axle models) (front and rear)
    Nissan Patrol Y60 and Y61

    Some of the most revered 4x4's in the world are in the above list. In fact, of the live-axle 4x4's with coil springs, it's basically only the Jeep that uses something different. And probably there are aftermarket "solutions" for most of the drawbacks in most of these vehicles.

    I believe it's biggest advantage is robustness. Nothing else comes close in that department, unless the components are absolutely massive.
    Last edited by Peter Connan; 2020/09/30 at 05:53 AM.
    Beat-up rat rod of a '96 Nissan Patrol that bears the evidence of many wonderful adventures (and a few stupid indiscretions).

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  25. #19
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gengis View Post
    Hi all
    The PO of my vehicle has done a fairly heafty lift but looking at some of the workmanship and corner cutting I doubt he checked the caster correction. The handeling is good ( compaired to my old series 2 LR) but has got a little "loose" on one or two ocasions. Now, I resently had the back springs replaced and they have not setteled yet, so will this afffect the caster if they measure it, and should I load up a bag or two of cement and sand at the back to a level which i think it should be at while it gets checked
    Shout if this does not make sense please

    G
    Loose on gravel or tar ? My first trip on gravel with the 76 it were all over the road. Fitted spacers at the back and it is like a train on a track.

  26. #20
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    Default Re: checking castor angle on a 76 Cruiser.

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Connan View Post
    The following permanent 4WD vehicles have conceptually identical three-link system in the front, and some even front and rear:
    80-series cruisers (those which have permanent 4WD)
    105-series cruisers
    Range Rover (all the live-axle models)
    Land Rover 90/110/Defender (all live axle models)
    Land Rover Discovery 1 and 2 (front and rear)
    Mercedes Gelandewagen (all the live-axle models) (front and rear)
    Nissan Patrol Y60 and Y61

    Some of the most revered 4x4's in the world are in the above list. In fact, of the live-axle 4x4's with coil springs, it's basically only the Jeep that uses something different. And probably there are aftermarket "solutions" for most of the drawbacks in most of these vehicles.

    I believe it's biggest advantage is robustness. Nothing else comes close in that department, unless the components are absolutely massive.
    I have seen lifted 4x4`s with three link suspensions front and rear that had a difference in tracking of about 50mm.
    You also get an enormous amount of rear wheel steer at full flex. Do not think the manufacturers had lifts in mind when they designed the three link suspension. It is important to do the corrections to keep everything lined up when doing suspension mods.

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