Ineos Grenadier revealed!! - Page 11





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  1. #201
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by byaru1 View Post
    I also suspect in real life persistent use it's hard for. 5.6 V8 petrol to drink less fuel.than a 4.5 V8 diesel. But perhaps they could be close.

    I've also seen some people state that the 4.6 V8 LC200 drinks near the same as the 4.5 d4d but I know a few owners of the 4.6 and from what they say it's very very unlikely.
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  2. #202
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Seems the just of my comment on vehicles becoming too tech laden was lost and turned into an argument about v8 fuel consumption!

    I did not make the comment on the new Patrol to talk about consumption, but rather to highlight that the rough and tough Patrols of old have also become computers on wheels. In 20 years from now most people would not want to touch these cars with a borrowed barge pole due to all the problematic electronics. Unless you have a PHD in computer science!

    Unfortunately vehicles that can be tinkered with in the enthusiasts back yard for years after their warranties have expired are disappearing from the market, unless some companies come up with cheaper but good quality after market replacement components.
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  3. #203
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooly View Post
    I'm sure that V8 Petrol is so heavy on juice you need to own an oilfield to run them.
    No
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  4. #204
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Same as all Land Rovers.
    And Toyota LC200
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  5. #205
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooly View Post
    Seems the just of my comment on vehicles becoming too tech laden was lost and turned into an argument about v8 fuel consumption!

    I did not make the comment on the new Patrol to talk about consumption
    Hehehe so why mention it then?
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  6. #206
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!


  7. #207
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooly View Post
    In 20 years from now most people would not want to touch these cars with a borrowed barge pole due to all the problematic electronics. Unless you have a PHD in computer science!
    I don't like the new electronic stuff either, but the we adapt. Not so many years ago the thought of electronic fuel injection on an off roader was unthinkable. These days nobody wants anything to do with a carburettor. People will and have learnt how to deal with electronics. In the end having a laptop or scan tool in the car will be like carrying a toolbox currently when overlanding. As it was like carrying extra leather straps and a bale of hay 150-200 years ago!
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  9. #208
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Francois Theron View Post
    I don't like the new electronic stuff either, but the we adapt. Not so many years ago the thought of electronic fuel injection on an off roader was unthinkable. These days nobody wants anything to do with a carburettor. People will and have learnt how to deal with electronics. In the end having a laptop or scan tool in the car will be like carrying a toolbox currently when overlanding. As it was like carrying extra leather straps and a bale of hay 150-200 years ago!
    That last bit would be true.....if the manufacturer's actually allowed people to access their software. As far as I am aware, no mainline car maker sells their diagnostic tools.....
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  10. #209
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    This is where the Market Research people @ LR get a reality lesson. Absolutly love the Grenadier concept.


    Quote Originally Posted by JBX View Post
    Very interesting. It looks like they will fit 6 cylinder BMW petrol and diesel turbo engine options combined with 8 speed gearbox (probably auto) and their own transfer box. This will be combined with 2 solid beam axles on coil suspension. 3 difflocks to be fitted.

    Just hope they do not get locked into some design copy battle in court.

    The BMW engine LR we built in SA was an early warning that this is what the market wants.

    Just show what can happen if you don't listen to your own customer base. LR spent 50 + years building a good product and reputation and then change direction into something not suited or affordable to their market.

    If the Grenadier sell at between R 400K and R 600K then LR Defender will have an uphill battle.
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  11. #210
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy of Arabia View Post
    This is where the Market Research people @ LR get a reality lesson. Absolutly love the Grenadier concept.
    Who should get the reality lesson from whom..

  12. #211
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Billy of Arabia View Post
    This is where the Market Research people @ LR get a reality lesson. Absolutly love the Grenadier concept.

    Its not to say they need a reality check because Grenadair is aiming for 20 000 units and Land Rover are going to sell 3 times that number in Defenders in theory. That will be considered a successful market research study from a business point of view.

    They chose a different market, a market where there is more money to be made.
    Last edited by Byron; 2020/07/09 at 03:01 PM.
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  14. #212
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    That last bit would be true.....if the manufacturer's actually allowed people to access their software. As far as I am aware, no mainline car maker sells their diagnostic tools.....
    The GAP IID tool allow you sometimes better diagnostics than LR themselves.I can select many options,like ride hight on the EAS!This tool is about my whole toolboxThis tool can not replace basic knowledge how a engine works but helps alot with the electronics,so much so that I can tell the workshop what is wrong!!My car is a 2012 model and up to now the electronics have not let me downAll problems mecanical!!

    And v8 consumpsion,according to LR official numbers the 4.4 TDv8 is more economical than the TDv6!!!I have managed 10l/100k @ 120,tank to tank fill,not readout.Some modern v8's are economical(relatively to what you get)
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  15. #213
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoFrans View Post
    The GAP IID tool allow you sometimes better diagnostics than LR themselves.I can select many options,like ride hight on the EAS!This tool is about my whole toolboxThis tool can not replace basic knowledge how a engine works but helps alot with the electronics,so much so that I can tell the workshop what is wrong!!My car is a 2012 model and up to now the electronics have not let me downAll problems mecanical!!And v8 consumpsion,according to LR official numbers the 4.4 TDv8 is more economical than the TDv6!!!I have managed 10l/100k @ 120,tank to tank fill,not readout.Some modern v8's are economical(relatively to what you get)
    Diagnosing a problem is only the start fixing it the problem.
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  16. #214
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8i rocks View Post
    Diagnosing a problem is only the start fixing it the problem.
    Very true,but at least you know where to start looking!!If you depend on the modern part fitters,then you could be in trouble
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  17. #215
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    DiscoFrans you miss my point.
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  18. #216
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoFrans View Post
    Very true,but at least you know where to start looking!!If you depend on the modern part fitters,then you could be in trouble
    Assuming the computer that you plug the diagnostic tool into is working! Or the computer that has to "speak" to the computer your diagnostic tool is plugged into.
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  19. #217
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hooly View Post
    Assuming the computer that you plug the diagnostic tool into is working! Or the computer that has to "speak" to the computer your diagnostic tool is plugged into.
    Bluetooth on tablet/phone,quite reliable.
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  20. #218
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoFrans View Post
    Bluetooth on tablet/phone,quite reliable.
    Hi Disco I'm assuming that you live in a connected world with a spares guy not to far away?
    A lot of us are on satalite internet in camp and nothing 30m later.
    It doesn't matter how good your Bluetooth is if you can't get the spares or if the problem is to bad and the vehicle to complex to make a temp plan to get home, regardless of mechanical or electrical.
    The grenadier is aiming for the back end of nowhere client, we need reliability, simplicity, durability and fixability with little to no ability.
    That's a lot of ity.
    Neil Rocher
    1997 2.8i Defender 110 (Fats)
    1996 300 TDI Defender 110 (Aqualung)
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  22. #219
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    Quote Originally Posted by 2.8i rocks View Post
    Hi Disco I'm assuming that you live in a connected world with a spares guy not to far away?
    A lot of us are on satalite internet in camp and nothing 30m later.
    It doesn't matter how good your Bluetooth is if you can't get the spares or if the problem is to bad and the vehicle to complex to make a temp plan to get home, regardless of mechanical or electrical.
    The grenadier is aiming for the back end of nowhere client, we need reliability, simplicity, durability and fixability with little to no ability.
    That's a lot of ity.
    Plus 5 years before somebody cracks the code
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  23. #220
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    Default Re: Ineos Grenadier revealed!!

    I think it would be very difficult to compare the sales of the new Defender with that of the Grenadier. The new Defender has been refined/softened in such a manner that it would draw a large appeal from "urban" users as well, I think. Many people driving Discoveries, Prados, Pajeros, X5's etc. would probably consider the new Defender as a great alternative. With the old Defender, people bought it mainly because it was a hard-core offroader with a great heritage and iconic design (i.e. it did not really appeal to urban users wanting comfort and refinement).

    The people buying the Grenadier would mainly just be offroad enthusiasts (i.e. ex Defender, Land Cruiser, Patrol and Wrangler owners).

    I, for one, would love to own a Grenadier one day!!
    Last edited by Danie Pienaar; 2020/07/10 at 05:29 PM.

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