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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by ekkekan View Post
    As most thermostats can adjust down to 30 degrees C what does one do with water this cold?
    Absolute minimum is the lowest hot water temperature that SWAMBO will accept as hot enough!

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  3. #22
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by the_terrible_triplett View Post
    R8 per day = R243 pm over 12 months. So about 1/4 of your bill because you made an effort.
    Normally geysers are about 1/3 of the bill.

    The rest of the power?
    First place I would start, measure the consumption when everyone is asleep.
    Next level, switch all circuits off at the DB. Then switch then on, one by one, and measure power draw.

    When I did the above, in my case, I found some very interesting power users like:
    1) Kitchen had a 4 tube fluorescent light fitting. Only one fluorescent tube inserted, yet it still drew +-250w.
    Reason: 4 x transformers all on, not just the one with the tube in.
    2) Clock Alarm radios. 3 of them. They drew collectively about 300w.

    Ripped the transformers out, went 11w LED tube and threw the Clock radios into the recycling bin.

    You literally have to do a power audit.
    Stem saam daar met jou. Einste hoekom ek my huis oor geskywe he LED ligte ook. Fluorescent tubes is net so n wetter. Het een in my garage gehad en na ek gesien het dat dit maklik 250w trek, oor geskywe na Osram se Led tubes. 2 saam trek net so oor sie 25w en way beter lig ook.

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  5. #23
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Mackay View Post
    Wat Geyserwise syteem het jy? PV of Evacuated Tubes?
    Tubes met temp control probe wat pomp beheer. Hardloop al 5 jaar sonder probleme. Somer raak hy so warm dat die over flow oor stoot. Daai water vang ek op in my garage en gebruik dit vir wasgoed. Winter sukkel hy weer dan n bietjie om op verby 50'c omdat die son se verby gaan grade laer is en jy het jou koeler dae. Geyser het n kombers om maar omdat my garage koeler is raak die geyser stelselmatig koeler in die winter waar in die somer is die geyser maklik nog 42'c in die oggend . Wil elk geval die geyser nog n kombers om sit. Nou met die solar krag hoef ek nou nie krag van die grid se kant af in stoot nie.

  6. #24
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Mackay View Post
    Absolute minimum is the lowest hot water temperature that SWAMBO will accept as hot enough!
    Just remember that the nasties start to grow below 55℃.
    Last edited by JanB; 2020/06/03 at 08:41 AM.
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  7. #25
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by JanB View Post
    Just remember that the nasties start to grow below 55℃.
    OMO will help for that 😁🤣

  8. #26
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerlach View Post
    Hardloop al 5 jaar sonder probleme.
    Over the +-10 years our EV tube system last, we enjoyed a huge ROI after having used the initial Eskom subsidy on top of that.

    My experience:
    My EV tubes lasted just just short of 10 years. Wow!!!
    1) In the end some of the tubes lost their vacuum - nope, no replacements available - all new required.
    2) Pump was ready for replacement.
    3) Power failures damaged the Geyserwise system board.
    4) And the Duratherm 10 year warranty geyser starting to leak - nope, no warranty bro, read the fine print carefully, fine print that has NO bearing on the leak.

    But, when I got quotes to replace the system again, I was shocked. I knew the first time we made a ROI, the 2nd time, not going to make the monies spent, back.

    So I opted to add 4 x 350w panels to my existing 6 x 350w array and upgraded my 3kva to a 5kva inverter.

    Not only does the geysers still get heated via solar, although not as efficient as with EV tubes in Cpt winter, but the entire house benefits from solar power.

    My takeaway:
    EV tubes is a very good starting point to save on Eskom. Cloudy winters in Cpt, EV tubes still add quite a bit.
    Heatpumps are a option too. The hotter the ambient air is the better they work, but do some research on them ito maintenance, pump replacement etc.

    Do some research on which option will give the best ROI per annum, maintenance and repairs kept in mind.

    And do keep in mind that like:
    Cpt has winter AND clouds, with long summer and no clouds.
    Vs winters with no clouds, with summer and clouds.
    Has an effect on system chosen.
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  10. #27
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Mackay View Post
    Absolute minimum is the lowest hot water temperature that SWAMBO will accept as hot enough!
    - just go read up about Legionnaire's disease (lung illness from inhaling contaminated water droplets) in systems that are constantly at luke warm temperatures.

    We need the system to go above ~55 deg C somewhere during the daily cycle to keep the diseases at bay.
    Last edited by vlakkie; 2020/06/03 at 02:28 PM.
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  12. #28
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerlach View Post
    Het een in my garage gehad en na ek gesien het dat dit maklik 250w trek, oor geskywe na Osram se Led tubes. 2 saam trek net so oor sie 25w en way beter lig ook.
    Ek dink julle abuse jul buisligte. Ek het steeds van hulle en ek het ook 'n krag meter wat ek duidelik kan sien wat hulle trek en nog nooit gesien dat 'n dubbel 1.5m buislig meer as 150-180W trek nie.

  13. #29
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by ekkekan View Post
    Ek dink julle abuse jul buisligte. Ek het steeds van hulle en ek het ook 'n krag meter wat ek duidelik kan sien wat hulle trek en nog nooit gesien dat 'n dubbel 1.5m buislig meer as 150-180W trek nie.
    Niks van home abuse hier nie. hahaha!! Dis basies aan sit as ek iets wil doen en af sit as ek loop. Dink my R69000 se instrement is baie presies met al sy CT clamps om daai inligting te gee.

    Moet nie verkeerd verstaan nie, ek was ook onder die indruk dat buislig nie swaar is nie, tot ek begin kyk het wat my data wys. Hulle is swaar. Ek het geskywe na Led buis ligte en die data het gewys dat dit baie ligter is.

    ooooo ja, Sonoff POW R2 is nie presies akkuraat nie :
    https://tasmota.github.io/docs/Power...g-Calibration/
    https://github.com/arendst/Tasmota/issues/3232
    https://github.com/arendst/Tasmota/issues/6302
    Last edited by Gerlach; 2020/06/03 at 04:43 PM.

  14. #30
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by ekkekan View Post
    Ek dink julle abuse jul buisligte. Ek het steeds van hulle en ek het ook 'n krag meter wat ek duidelik kan sien wat hulle trek en nog nooit gesien dat 'n dubbel 1.5m buislig meer as 150-180W trek nie.
    Jy moet mooi kyk WAT kort jou buislig om hom te maak werk.

    Per 4 voet buislig van +-30w elk PLUS 1 x 50w transformer per buislig = 80w x 4 in my geval = 320w vir 4 x 4 voet buisligte ... yeah right.
    vs
    4 x11w LED buislig = 44w

    En ek het nou meer lig ...
    Last edited by the_terrible_triplett; 2020/06/03 at 06:57 PM.
    Political Correctness
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    Saw this in a pub - no idea why the wife does not see it so:
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  15. #31
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by the_terrible_triplett View Post
    Jy moet mooi kyk WAT kort jou buislig om hom te maak werk.

    Per 4 voet buislig van +-30w elk PLUS 1 x 50w transformer per buislig = 80w x 4 in my geval = 320w vir 4 x 4 voet buisligte ... yeah right.
    vs
    4 x11w LED buislig = 44w

    En ek het nou meer lig ...
    Ek het geensins te kenne gegee dat LED nie baie minder krag gebruik nie.

    Ek dink net hoe meer jy probeer motiveer dat jou 30W - 4 voet buislig 80W gebruik het hoe meer is daar sparkies wat nie sou verwag het jou buisligte het elkeen 80W gebruik. Dit is nie 'n geval van 'n lig gebruik 30W en die transformator gebruik nog 50W nie. Hulle is in serie met mekaar.

    Hier is bv my huidige verbruik vir alles wat in my huis aan is op 165W en as ek 'n enkel 5 voet buislig aansit styg dit tot 224.3W. Die verskil is 59.3W. Die buis is 'n 58W eenheid.

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  17. #32
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by ekkekan View Post
    Ek dink net hoe meer jy probeer motiveer dat jou 30W - 4 voet buislig 80W gebruik het hoe meer is daar sparkies wat nie sou verwag het jou buisligte het elkeen 80W gebruik. Dit is nie 'n geval van 'n lig gebruik 30W en die transformator gebruik nog 50W nie. Hulle is in serie met mekaar.
    Sonder enige buise in, net die 4 x 50w transformers aan, het ek 200w gemeet op daai circuit.

    Hele lig moes herbedraad word toe die transformers uitgehaal is.
    Political Correctness
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    Saw this in a pub - no idea why the wife does not see it so:
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  18. #33
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by the_terrible_triplett View Post
    Sonder enige buise in, net die 4 x 50w transformers aan, het ek 200w gemeet op daai circuit.

    Hele lig moes herbedraad word toe die transformers uitgehaal is.
    Nou raak die gesprek net meer interessant. Die sogenaamde Trfr is in serie met die buis. So as die buis uitgehaal is kan geen krag vloei nie. Dis so goed as wat mens 1 draad op die positief v 'n battery sit en niks op die negatief en dan sÍ daar vloei stroom in die stukkie draad. Daar is wel 'n kondisie wat kan veroorsaak dat die lig 200W gebruik het maar dis nie die buis lig nie. 'n Bespreking vir 'n ander dag.

  19. #34
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by ekkekan View Post
    Nou raak die gesprek net meer interessant.
    Vir baie lank net 1 buis in daardie lig gesit, ipv al 4. Gedink ek spaar BAIE krag.
    Political Correctness
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    Saw this in a pub - no idea why the wife does not see it so:
    I'm not opinionated ... I'm just always right!

  20. #35
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gerlach View Post
    Doen die af gelope paar dae n toets. Ek hardloop offgrid system en dump my extra krag in my geyser in nou. Met die winter tel die solar geyser met geyser wise setup nie genoeg op nie. Ek hardloop n Shelly EM setup met CT clamps op my main input en dan 2de clamp op die geyser se kant. Van daar af n Wifi controller/relay wat n hat het ook. Die die Shelly het n relay output wat in die hat van die wifi controller/relay in gaan so ek kan control oor die hat van die Shelly se kant af. Jy kan die Shelly dan stel dat as dit optel dat die load te groot raak op die main CT clamp se kant dan switch die Shelly die the 2de CT clamp se kant af wat op die geyser se kant is op die solar, tot die load minder weer raak, dan switch die shelly die load weer op die geyser aan.

    Tussen die Solar se kant van die geyser AC en van die Grid se kant van die Geyser wise controller hardloop 2 25A Contactors wat ge interlock is met interlock link. So as die geyser wise manual aan gesit word, dan switch die een contactor aan maar lock die solar/inverter se kant and vasa visa, so niks van grid blend stuff daar nie. Geyser het , 3.2kw element in.

    My MLT inverter kan die goed maar dis n hele storie wat op gestel moet word.

    Teen so 11uur is my lifepo4's vol gelaai, dan dump ek my extra solar krag oor geyser se kant om hom warm te maak. Soos Bv van oggend, was my Geyser 29'c. ek het so 45min se solar krag in gedump daar, en toe weer so 15min sin by. toe staan hy op 58'c. Was so 3.3kw se solar krag wat ek daar in ge dump het.
    As jy n offgrid system het en jy het grid krag vir backup hoe werk dit?
    Ek verstaan hoe jou geyser werk met PV krag as dit beskibaar is maar wat van die ander loads? Is hulle deel van die off grid systeem?
    As ek reg is hoe skakel jou systeem oor na grid krag??

  21. #36
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Mackay View Post
    As jy n offgrid system het en jy het grid krag vir backup hoe werk dit?
    Ek verstaan hoe jou geyser werk met PV krag as dit beskibaar is maar wat van die ander loads? Is hulle deel van die off grid systeem?
    As ek reg is hoe skakel jou systeem oor na grid krag??
    My db is gesplit. Soos my ligte en plugs hardloop van die inverter af, altwee het hulle eie 3 way change over switch om dit te isolate van die grid af weg en kan terug change as ek ligte of plugs terug op die grid wil sit vir backup as ek aan die system moet werk. My stoof is op die grid want hy is n swaar load maar gaan change na gas toe binekort. My geyser het ek op die grid gelos daai tyd tot ek als uit gesort het tot 2 weke terug wat ek die 2 contactors met interlock install het. Dit is soos n 3way change over switch wat ek kan kies tussen die grid en solar maar ek kan dit elektronies beheer nou en die interlock voorkom dat ek die 2 saam gelyk in die geyser in stoot nie.Daar is n paar videos op die net wat wys hoe dit werk. Het gister my Temp probe setup gekry so dat ek die temp deur my foon kan dop hou en kan stel tussen wat se temp die die solar sy krag kan dump na die geyser tot hy warm raak en dan die contactor af switch of kan stel tussen wat se tye hy moet hardloop.
    Last edited by Gerlach; 2020/06/04 at 11:27 PM.

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  23. #37
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by the_terrible_triplett View Post
    Vir baie lank net 1 buis in daardie lig gesit, ipv al 4. Gedink ek spaar BAIE krag.
    Hier kan jy duidelik sien dat as jy die buis verwyder breek jy die 220V toevoer op 2 plekke aan weerskante v d blou streep. Dus kan geen krag meer vloei nie. Verder kan mens sien dat die buis nie 30W gebruik en "transformator" 'n verdere 50W om dus 80W te gebruik soos jy bevind het.
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  24. #38
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by ekkekan View Post
    Hier kan jy duidelik sien dat as jy die buis verwyder breek jy die 220V toevoer op 2 plekke aan weerskante v d blou streep.
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    Ek hoor jou ... nou hoe kon ek 1 buislig gebruik het ipv al 4?
    Dit het my EN die sparkie lekker confuse ten tye.
    Political Correctness
    Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional illogical minority, rabidly promoted by a unscrupulous mainstream media which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd ... by the clean end!

    Saw this in a pub - no idea why the wife does not see it so:
    I'm not opinionated ... I'm just always right!

  25. #39
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by the_terrible_triplett View Post
    Ek hoor jou ... nou hoe kon ek 1 buislig gebruik het ipv al 4?
    Dit het my EN die sparkie lekker confuse ten tye.
    Ek kan mos nie weet hoekom was jy en die sparkie confuse. Die stroombaan op die foto is vir 1 buis en jy kan dus 1 2 3 of 4 gebruik.

  26. #40
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    Default Re: Solar geyser backup element usage.

    Quote Originally Posted by ekkekan View Post
    Ek kan mos nie weet hoekom was jy en die sparkie confuse. Die stroombaan op die foto is vir 1 buis en jy kan dus 1 2 3 of 4 gebruik.
    Ons mis mekaar ... of ek mis jou.

    As ek die buisligte uithaal, stroom is gebreek, het die transformers nog steeds krag gebuik, 4 x 50w, sonder dat een buis in was, as jy die lig aan sou sit.
    Political Correctness
    Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional illogical minority, rabidly promoted by a unscrupulous mainstream media which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd ... by the clean end!

    Saw this in a pub - no idea why the wife does not see it so:
    I'm not opinionated ... I'm just always right!

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