Landrover - you have truly saddened me.. - Page 4





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  1. #61
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcochezzi View Post
    Landrover – honestly, I expected just a little more from you…

    A short story, because I like telling stories, and since you are here, I guess you like reading them...

    So while this is not intended as a bitch session, it might actually well be, not that I expect that Landrover SA will ever give a flying toss, however in some small way I hope this letter finds its way to John (Pseudonym), the service manager at Landrover branchname Somewhere in Gauteng, between Alberton And Sandton, and to his client liaison officer Marcy (not really sure if this is the correct job title.. but what the hell, we’ll use it, and for the sake of anonymity, another pseudonym)

    Pseudonyms are being used here, since I do not want to get into a legal battle with Her Majesty’s finest, but heck, John, if you read this, you know who you are, and just somehow, I think you will...

    So, my 2014 RR SC 405 Fattie, damn..., heck of a vehicle, genuine, like I smile every time I use it... She makes me feel good in a manly kind of way, and please, genuinely, please don’t pass comment that the fattie is compensation for a small nana or some crap like that, because quite honestly the only one who would know if that is true or false is my wife (and ok quite possibly also my GP since he has worked on some tubes down there..), and my wife sure as hell won’t tell you if it’s true, then no sense going further right, I mean if it is true, well, I guess I would not know better as I still have all the fun, with the long or the short of it so to say……

    Anyway, I digress, however my driving smile became a bit of a grimace a few weeks back...

    Let’s picture the scene since inception... somewhere around the 31K mark I noted a rather annoying rumble on this vehicle, only apparent around 120-140kph, mostly on deceleration, irrespective whether in neutral or in gear.
    LR Branch Somewhere Between Alberton and Sandton changed literally everything that spun under her, short of the motor and gearbox, took ages, as these things do, but I remained loyal and calm, and for what it’s worth, no matter the depth of despair that they might have felt in trying as best they could to resolve my issues, they were not doing me a favour, it’s part of the 5 year contract, if its fu..ed, they fix it, it’s called obligation, not favour..

    They never fixed it… I was shirked off after an untold amount of time being told that the noise it makes is now considered standard.. John, the service manager (pseudonym) does that when his back is to a wall, the shirk off thing, it pisses me off, badly, like really really frikking annoys me, because that means that you are taking me for granted, or classifying me an idiot, which while I might have some issues, I am no idiot, but then hey, who am I but a mere annoying pimple on the arse of a giant somewhere between Alberton and Sandton right…

    His statement of “acceptable standard” makes me laugh though as they sure as hell accepted and attempted the repair by changing literally everything (I’m repeating myself here) that spins, so the little pip residing beetle must have pulled a lever in the collective Landrover technical team brain, because lets be serious, who the f..k is going to fork out that kind of money undertaking a repair that is not necessary since the symptom is not a symptom but a functional norm…

    Around the 38 or 39K mark I returned to them, swallowed my pride and stupidly (yes, I am prone to be stupid from time to time) ignoring the fact that the initial rumble in the jungle repair still rumbled in the jungle, took it upon myself to explain to the self-same John (Pseudonym) that now the transfer case clunks, and thumps, and chatters, and groans. This only happens in a sharp turn, from standstill.

    However, what I did do, is research the symptom, as neither my 302SC or 322SC did the same thing, despite both having had much much much higher mileages...

    Turns out there is a LR technical bulletin out there (I have the copy) to do with this very symptom, got to do with the transfer case fluid and clutches in the case binding etc etc...

    The simple solution to all this is a fluid double flush, plus the upload of some mystical mystery LR software, ‘cause goodness knows if you do not include that software the vehicle will implode, whilst you are on the N1 trying to prove to a nation that she gets to 225…

    “Yes”, agreed John (Pseudonym), you are quite correct, in fact we at branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton employ a Tecchie (not being derogatory here, I’m also a Tecchie..) whose sole purpose is to take care of these faults, often we take it up a level and change clutch packs as well if so required….

    So I guess, possibly mistaken though, that this fault is a hell of a lot more common than what is imagined, since they employ the Tecchie for the sole purpose thereof…….

    So, book her in, somewhere around March last year… Go back 3 or 5 days later (memory is vague at my age...) to collect the fattie, now sporting a brand brand brand new transfer case, not reconditioned mind you, brand new, no double oil flush in the original box, brand new...!!

    “Why??” I asked..

    ‘Cause it’s easier and under warranty...

    Jeez, imagine that, changing a transfer case is easier than a double flush and arbitrary data upload..., anyway, who am I to complain about how JLR chooses to burn Her Majesty’s money

    ————————————-


    That was March / April last year

    June 2019 the vehicle falls out of her 5-year plan...

    July / August vehicle calls for service, time mind you, not mileage, sh1t she barely had 40K on her, if that…

    So I change oil, oil filters, air filters… me, not branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton, me, and by the way thanks again MikeBob for your kind sponsorship, it is not forgotten!!

    Fast forward January 2020, and the transfer case clunk returns, first not much, by end January she was literally dragging her arse around every tight turn.

    So off I go to LR branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton, on a Saturday mind you, only to find Marcy (pseudonym) the service client liaison officer willing to help...

    I explained the scenario, naturally concerned, to which I was informed that JLR might be willing to help as the transfer case is only 8 or 9 months old, even though the vehicle is out of the 5 year plan, “however”’ she states in a questioning way, “You were supposed to have a service done with us on the vehicle in July – one month after the end of the plan, why did you miss it..??”

    “Actually did not miss it”, I said, “I did however do it all myself, she was out of warrantee and I was technically not obligated to return to you”

    “Well then we cannot help” she replied respectfully...

    “Why?” I asked, “The known transfer case issue has jack to do with the fact that engine oil and filters were changed, jack...”

    “Ya but It’s one car..”

    “That’s like my wife going to the fanny doctor to complain about her failed tooth repair”, I state, “despite the doctor arguing that he had jack to do with her tooth, your reply is equivalent to her telling the fanny doctor, but it’s one body….” (in a roundabout kind of way)

    There was a moments silence….

    “look”, she said, “come back in the new week and have a chat with John the service manager…”

    “Cool”, I reply, and off I went…

    Bet you all know where this is going right, I mean if you made it this far, you might as well read on...

    New week Monday, John says, “no problem, bring her in Wednesday and I’ll see what I can do...”

    Wednesday take her in, dealing with the same Marcy, perfectly professional as one would expect.

    And then the dreaded almost expected silence of the lambs…

    Come Friday afternoon, late, I call and chat to Marcy, “so where the hell is my car?” I ask....

    “look”, she said, “We tried, but there is no way around the non-service issue, sorry, genuine..”

    “So what is the next step?”, I ask

    “So the transfer case needs replacing..

    “Again”, I say, that must be an all time record..

    “Yes” Marcy replies, “and that including 8 bolts excluding labour is R100K..”

    “100K..??”, I repeat, “that’s 2 transfer cases in 9 months, maybe 10 months at a stretch….., 100K??”

    “Yes”, she replied again, “100k…”

    Think about this folks, that’s a 1 with 5 zero’s, R100 000.00, read that, that’s a shedload of somethings, anythings, whateverthings...
    Now that might not be much if you are Zuma or a paid member of his 225 735 strong band of thieves clan, me, I’m really a pretty ordinary bloke, and those 5 zeros count..!!

    “Is my car in one piece”, I ask

    “Yes”, she replies…

    “Cool”, I say, “Leave her be, I’m on the way to fetch her….”

    “But she’s not washed yet”, she replies…

    “No issues there”, I say, “please leave her be”, fearing the wash might land up costing me R2K…

    Get to the dealer branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton Friday afternoon late, it was relatively quiet, John (pseudonym) was attached to his phone, Marcy (pseudonym) beckoned me on sheepishly..

    “I’m sorry”, she stated, “We really did try, but that service thing just got in the way..”

    “Yep”, I say, not wanting to repeat the fanny doctor thing, “However I do not really believe you, you see”, I reply to her obvious surprise / concern / Landrover client Liaison officer possibly fake reaction..

    “The way I see it”, I continued, “Is that you did jack on the car, maybe even less than jack, in fact in all probability your service manager John (pseudonym) probably told you to call me with some arbitrary inflated figure after you ran to him to question what to do next, in order that I just turn around and walk away, and if that is the case it really really annoys me, but of course, it’s all assumption on my part and I will never be able to prove that will I?”

    “I’m really sorry”, she replied..

    “So then that’s it?”, I ask, “Nothing more?”

    “Nope”, she confirms, “That’s pretty much it…”

    “Do I owe you anything for this?”, I ask..

    “Nope”, she replied.. “you are welcome to leave with the vehicle now if you wish, will you need a pass out card??”..

    “Just one question please before I leave if I may”, I ask quietly. “What about the JLR technical bulletin for a double flush on the box, that’s all they ever mentioned you should do, nothing more nothing less, my question to you positioned with all due respect and not being an arse here, why did you or John not even offer me that solution, I mean, you had that option didn’t you, its not like you ‘have’ to change the transfer case, in all reality that was the last and most ridiculous option, the first option was to follow your JLR technical bulletin, which I reminded you of at the very beginning of this little adventure, so you did have another immediate option at your disposal, which all things considered, I would have gladly paid for, since you seemingly had her on a lift already, why did you not offer me that option??..”

    She minced on that for a while, and then replied, “Sir, I hear you, and this time I honestly have no words, I have no answer for you, there’s nothing more I can add to that..”

    How’s that for a reply good people, service level 101 breached, I remember reading a thread a few days back about our shocking service levels and rate of call returns, tell me this does not fit the bill…

    “Thank you for your help” I said respectfully, and left, knocking gently on Johns office window wall panel whilst exiting, he still clutching his phone, offering him a thumbs up in thanks for his efforts, I guess I‘m still old school and I do pay respect..

    Now look, I’m no genius, but transfer cases are just not such complex pieces of kit in my eyes, hell I virtually redesigned my entire ’76 Jeep quadratrac transfer case, the original transfer case mind you, which for what it’s worth holds the title of the world’s first all-aluminium, chain driven, permanent 4wd with centre diff and torsen (similar) style limited slip functionality (Borg Warner..), I could write a book on that case, not to mention the Dana cases I have worked on and modified quite extensively, still all functional, it’s really all meccano ultimately…

    The fatties transfer case is just another chain driven (chain = front only) permanent 4wd transfer case with electronic locking centre diff, the diff being controlled through clutchplates such that they can engage & lock in an instant, while rotating, without having to stop or slow down etc etc etc. They are clutchplates, made of clutch plate stuff, not some form of exclusive product available only to the secret locked and fed through a window technical dept of the JLR transfer case team…

    Yes, I understand that the functionality of those plates might shift through different states of “applied pressure” such that the fatties clever all terrain control system functions as it should, but I’m sceptical in that regard for now, personally I believe It’s either open, or locked, nothing more..

    So what to do, what to do, what to do.…??...

    That was Friday 2 weeks back.. Saturday I go and purchase Land Rover transfer case fluid made of Sperm whale sap and compressed Beeno’s, I describe it as that because if you have smelt the sh1t, you would agree…

    Fattie takes 1,5 litres, I purchase 3 litres, yep double flush maths… 3 litres came to give or take R1 680, including vat…

    Jacked the suspension to max height, ice cream tub under the belly of the beast, cracked open the drain nut-bolt thing and watched the stinky stuff leave the dormitory.. 3 minutes to get to that stage I think, maximum…

    Replaced the drain plug, removed the filler plug and pumped the fresh sperm whale / beenos sap into the inlet, 1,5 litres, probably 3 minutes as well..

    Specs say drive the vehicle for 10 minutes and then repeat the drain – fill thing…

    Thought I’d give it a little more time to make use of the fresh fluid so drove for three days on the first replacement fluid… nothing, like nothing, not a pop, not a groan, not a grunt, not a drag, not a thump….

    3 days later I replaced the fluid for the 2nd refill, and yes, its whisper quiet and smooth..

    Now look, I have no doubt that now that I have written this short story, my transfercase will implode in another 2 weeks time, and if that happens, I will take pics and post, however, for now I will let sleeping Sperm whales lie..

    Have since then chatted to a good mate who has a M3 amongst his arsenal, surprisingly he mentioned the exact thing happens on the limited slip diff on that specific model, when it does you don’t replace the diff, you simply change the BMW Sperm whale oil and drive on until next time.. I mean, Would you believe it, think about how many M3 limited slip differential factories around the world are going bust....

    More research revealed that a fellow in the UK on one of the popular Fattie websites simply replaces the oil on a yearly basis, it’s just not worth being bothered about it, just do it and be done…

    So there you have it.. R100k, R1,6k, bet if the damn thing pukes Ill get it all repaired on my workbench for less than R10k, including a chain for R3k..

    That’s crap service Landrover, like really really crap. Quite frankly, I deserved better, not free, but better, which you were able to provide if you just tried a little harder. Your lack of compassion shines through as arrogant, and I fear this will stand you in poor stead in years to come.

    That day, in my heart, I was truly saddened to have flown your flag, been your customer and supporter of your product..

    Yours truly – A pimple on the arse of a giant, somewhere between Alberton and Sandton..

  2. #62
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    I read that to the end. It was worth the read. Where can I subscribe!! These days you had better be able to fix your car.




    Quote Originally Posted by tashtego9 View Post
    I was reading your post while sitting on the loo, Donald style, and such was the laughter and mirth that swambo barged in thinking (hoping?) that I was choking to death...
    Hmm could you start another thread detailing what you do in the toilet, that would lead her to believe you could CHOKE? eager
    2018 Nissan X-Trail 2.5

  3. #63
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcochezzi View Post
    Landrover – honestly, I expected just a little more from you…

    A short story, because I like telling stories, and since you are here, I guess you like reading them...

    So while this is not intended as a bitch session, it might actually well be, not that I expect that Landrover SA will ever give a flying toss, however in some small way I hope this letter finds its way to John (Pseudonym), the service manager at Landrover branchname Somewhere in Gauteng, between Alberton And Sandton, and to his client liaison officer Marcy (not really sure if this is the correct job title.. but what the hell, we’ll use it, and for the sake of anonymity, another pseudonym)

    Pseudonyms are being used here, since I do not want to get into a legal battle with Her Majesty’s finest, but heck, John, if you read this, you know who you are, and just somehow, I think you will...

    So, my 2014 RR SC 405 Fattie, damn..., heck of a vehicle, genuine, like I smile every time I use it... She makes me feel good in a manly kind of way, and please, genuinely, please don’t pass comment that the fattie is compensation for a small nana or some crap like that, because quite honestly the only one who would know if that is true or false is my wife (and ok quite possibly also my GP since he has worked on some tubes down there..), and my wife sure as hell won’t tell you if it’s true, then no sense going further right, I mean if it is true, well, I guess I would not know better as I still have all the fun, with the long or the short of it so to say……

    Anyway, I digress, however my driving smile became a bit of a grimace a few weeks back...

    Let’s picture the scene since inception... somewhere around the 31K mark I noted a rather annoying rumble on this vehicle, only apparent around 120-140kph, mostly on deceleration, irrespective whether in neutral or in gear.
    LR Branch Somewhere Between Alberton and Sandton changed literally everything that spun under her, short of the motor and gearbox, took ages, as these things do, but I remained loyal and calm, and for what it’s worth, no matter the depth of despair that they might have felt in trying as best they could to resolve my issues, they were not doing me a favour, it’s part of the 5 year contract, if its fu..ed, they fix it, it’s called obligation, not favour..

    They never fixed it… I was shirked off after an untold amount of time being told that the noise it makes is now considered standard.. John, the service manager (pseudonym) does that when his back is to a wall, the shirk off thing, it pisses me off, badly, like really really frikking annoys me, because that means that you are taking me for granted, or classifying me an idiot, which while I might have some issues, I am no idiot, but then hey, who am I but a mere annoying pimple on the arse of a giant somewhere between Alberton and Sandton right…

    His statement of “acceptable standard” makes me laugh though as they sure as hell accepted and attempted the repair by changing literally everything (I’m repeating myself here) that spins, so the little pip residing beetle must have pulled a lever in the collective Landrover technical team brain, because lets be serious, who the f..k is going to fork out that kind of money undertaking a repair that is not necessary since the symptom is not a symptom but a functional norm…

    Around the 38 or 39K mark I returned to them, swallowed my pride and stupidly (yes, I am prone to be stupid from time to time) ignoring the fact that the initial rumble in the jungle repair still rumbled in the jungle, took it upon myself to explain to the self-same John (Pseudonym) that now the transfer case clunks, and thumps, and chatters, and groans. This only happens in a sharp turn, from standstill.

    However, what I did do, is research the symptom, as neither my 302SC or 322SC did the same thing, despite both having had much much much higher mileages...

    Turns out there is a LR technical bulletin out there (I have the copy) to do with this very symptom, got to do with the transfer case fluid and clutches in the case binding etc etc...

    The simple solution to all this is a fluid double flush, plus the upload of some mystical mystery LR software, ‘cause goodness knows if you do not include that software the vehicle will implode, whilst you are on the N1 trying to prove to a nation that she gets to 225…

    “Yes”, agreed John (Pseudonym), you are quite correct, in fact we at branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton employ a Tecchie (not being derogatory here, I’m also a Tecchie..) whose sole purpose is to take care of these faults, often we take it up a level and change clutch packs as well if so required….

    So I guess, possibly mistaken though, that this fault is a hell of a lot more common than what is imagined, since they employ the Tecchie for the sole purpose thereof…….

    So, book her in, somewhere around March last year… Go back 3 or 5 days later (memory is vague at my age...) to collect the fattie, now sporting a brand brand brand new transfer case, not reconditioned mind you, brand new, no double oil flush in the original box, brand new...!!

    “Why??” I asked..

    ‘Cause it’s easier and under warranty...

    Jeez, imagine that, changing a transfer case is easier than a double flush and arbitrary data upload..., anyway, who am I to complain about how JLR chooses to burn Her Majesty’s money

    ————————————-


    That was March / April last year

    June 2019 the vehicle falls out of her 5-year plan...

    July / August vehicle calls for service, time mind you, not mileage, sh1t she barely had 40K on her, if that…

    So I change oil, oil filters, air filters… me, not branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton, me, and by the way thanks again MikeBob for your kind sponsorship, it is not forgotten!!

    Fast forward January 2020, and the transfer case clunk returns, first not much, by end January she was literally dragging her arse around every tight turn.

    So off I go to LR branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton, on a Saturday mind you, only to find Marcy (pseudonym) the service client liaison officer willing to help...

    I explained the scenario, naturally concerned, to which I was informed that JLR might be willing to help as the transfer case is only 8 or 9 months old, even though the vehicle is out of the 5 year plan, “however”’ she states in a questioning way, “You were supposed to have a service done with us on the vehicle in July – one month after the end of the plan, why did you miss it..??”

    “Actually did not miss it”, I said, “I did however do it all myself, she was out of warrantee and I was technically not obligated to return to you”

    “Well then we cannot help” she replied respectfully...

    “Why?” I asked, “The known transfer case issue has jack to do with the fact that engine oil and filters were changed, jack...”

    “Ya but It’s one car..”

    “That’s like my wife going to the fanny doctor to complain about her failed tooth repair”, I state, “despite the doctor arguing that he had jack to do with her tooth, your reply is equivalent to her telling the fanny doctor, but it’s one body….” (in a roundabout kind of way)

    There was a moments silence….

    “look”, she said, “come back in the new week and have a chat with John the service manager…”

    “Cool”, I reply, and off I went…

    Bet you all know where this is going right, I mean if you made it this far, you might as well read on...

    New week Monday, John says, “no problem, bring her in Wednesday and I’ll see what I can do...”

    Wednesday take her in, dealing with the same Marcy, perfectly professional as one would expect.

    And then the dreaded almost expected silence of the lambs…

    Come Friday afternoon, late, I call and chat to Marcy, “so where the hell is my car?” I ask....

    “look”, she said, “We tried, but there is no way around the non-service issue, sorry, genuine..”

    “So what is the next step?”, I ask

    “So the transfer case needs replacing..

    “Again”, I say, that must be an all time record..

    “Yes” Marcy replies, “and that including 8 bolts excluding labour is R100K..”

    “100K..??”, I repeat, “that’s 2 transfer cases in 9 months, maybe 10 months at a stretch….., 100K??”

    “Yes”, she replied again, “100k…”

    Think about this folks, that’s a 1 with 5 zero’s, R100 000.00, read that, that’s a shedload of somethings, anythings, whateverthings...
    Now that might not be much if you are Zuma or a paid member of his 225 735 strong band of thieves clan, me, I’m really a pretty ordinary bloke, and those 5 zeros count..!!

    “Is my car in one piece”, I ask

    “Yes”, she replies…

    “Cool”, I say, “Leave her be, I’m on the way to fetch her….”

    “But she’s not washed yet”, she replies…

    “No issues there”, I say, “please leave her be”, fearing the wash might land up costing me R2K…

    Get to the dealer branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton Friday afternoon late, it was relatively quiet, John (pseudonym) was attached to his phone, Marcy (pseudonym) beckoned me on sheepishly..

    “I’m sorry”, she stated, “We really did try, but that service thing just got in the way..”

    “Yep”, I say, not wanting to repeat the fanny doctor thing, “However I do not really believe you, you see”, I reply to her obvious surprise / concern / Landrover client Liaison officer possibly fake reaction..

    “The way I see it”, I continued, “Is that you did jack on the car, maybe even less than jack, in fact in all probability your service manager John (pseudonym) probably told you to call me with some arbitrary inflated figure after you ran to him to question what to do next, in order that I just turn around and walk away, and if that is the case it really really annoys me, but of course, it’s all assumption on my part and I will never be able to prove that will I?”

    “I’m really sorry”, she replied..

    “So then that’s it?”, I ask, “Nothing more?”

    “Nope”, she confirms, “That’s pretty much it…”

    “Do I owe you anything for this?”, I ask..

    “Nope”, she replied.. “you are welcome to leave with the vehicle now if you wish, will you need a pass out card??”..

    “Just one question please before I leave if I may”, I ask quietly. “What about the JLR technical bulletin for a double flush on the box, that’s all they ever mentioned you should do, nothing more nothing less, my question to you positioned with all due respect and not being an arse here, why did you or John not even offer me that solution, I mean, you had that option didn’t you, its not like you ‘have’ to change the transfer case, in all reality that was the last and most ridiculous option, the first option was to follow your JLR technical bulletin, which I reminded you of at the very beginning of this little adventure, so you did have another immediate option at your disposal, which all things considered, I would have gladly paid for, since you seemingly had her on a lift already, why did you not offer me that option??..”

    She minced on that for a while, and then replied, “Sir, I hear you, and this time I honestly have no words, I have no answer for you, there’s nothing more I can add to that..”

    How’s that for a reply good people, service level 101 breached, I remember reading a thread a few days back about our shocking service levels and rate of call returns, tell me this does not fit the bill…

    “Thank you for your help” I said respectfully, and left, knocking gently on Johns office window wall panel whilst exiting, he still clutching his phone, offering him a thumbs up in thanks for his efforts, I guess I‘m still old school and I do pay respect..

    Now look, I’m no genius, but transfer cases are just not such complex pieces of kit in my eyes, hell I virtually redesigned my entire ’76 Jeep quadratrac transfer case, the original transfer case mind you, which for what it’s worth holds the title of the world’s first all-aluminium, chain driven, permanent 4wd with centre diff and torsen (similar) style limited slip functionality (Borg Warner..), I could write a book on that case, not to mention the Dana cases I have worked on and modified quite extensively, still all functional, it’s really all meccano ultimately…

    The fatties transfer case is just another chain driven (chain = front only) permanent 4wd transfer case with electronic locking centre diff, the diff being controlled through clutchplates such that they can engage & lock in an instant, while rotating, without having to stop or slow down etc etc etc. They are clutchplates, made of clutch plate stuff, not some form of exclusive product available only to the secret locked and fed through a window technical dept of the JLR transfer case team…

    Yes, I understand that the functionality of those plates might shift through different states of “applied pressure” such that the fatties clever all terrain control system functions as it should, but I’m sceptical in that regard for now, personally I believe It’s either open, or locked, nothing more..

    So what to do, what to do, what to do.…??...

    That was Friday 2 weeks back.. Saturday I go and purchase Land Rover transfer case fluid made of Sperm whale sap and compressed Beeno’s, I describe it as that because if you have smelt the sh1t, you would agree…

    Fattie takes 1,5 litres, I purchase 3 litres, yep double flush maths… 3 litres came to give or take R1 680, including vat…

    Jacked the suspension to max height, ice cream tub under the belly of the beast, cracked open the drain nut-bolt thing and watched the stinky stuff leave the dormitory.. 3 minutes to get to that stage I think, maximum…

    Replaced the drain plug, removed the filler plug and pumped the fresh sperm whale / beenos sap into the inlet, 1,5 litres, probably 3 minutes as well..

    Specs say drive the vehicle for 10 minutes and then repeat the drain – fill thing…

    Thought I’d give it a little more time to make use of the fresh fluid so drove for three days on the first replacement fluid… nothing, like nothing, not a pop, not a groan, not a grunt, not a drag, not a thump….

    3 days later I replaced the fluid for the 2nd refill, and yes, its whisper quiet and smooth..

    Now look, I have no doubt that now that I have written this short story, my transfercase will implode in another 2 weeks time, and if that happens, I will take pics and post, however, for now I will let sleeping Sperm whales lie..

    Have since then chatted to a good mate who has a M3 amongst his arsenal, surprisingly he mentioned the exact thing happens on the limited slip diff on that specific model, when it does you don’t replace the diff, you simply change the BMW Sperm whale oil and drive on until next time.. I mean, Would you believe it, think about how many M3 limited slip differential factories around the world are going bust....

    More research revealed that a fellow in the UK on one of the popular Fattie websites simply replaces the oil on a yearly basis, it’s just not worth being bothered about it, just do it and be done…

    So there you have it.. R100k, R1,6k, bet if the damn thing pukes Ill get it all repaired on my workbench for less than R10k, including a chain for R3k..

    That’s crap service Landrover, like really really crap. Quite frankly, I deserved better, not free, but better, which you were able to provide if you just tried a little harder. Your lack of compassion shines through as arrogant, and I fear this will stand you in poor stead in years to come.

    That day, in my heart, I was truly saddened to have flown your flag, been your customer and supporter of your product..

    Yours truly – A pimple on the arse of a giant, somewhere between Alberton and Sandton..
    Last edited by Grant Anderson; 2020/02/11 at 06:37 AM. Reason: that was a great read and good on you.

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Good read..Thank you.

    The Jeep WJ series gives the same clunks..groans...binding on the rear wheels due to the Varilock difs in them. Had guys showing up at me where Jeep wants to replace a complete diff because of it.
    Flush the diff oil. Replace with correct oil and ad friction modifier for the clutchpacks.
    Diff is good for another 50K Km for less than R2000-00

    The mind boggles how the Stealers rips people of.
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    How many others have had similar experiences?I had a problem like this with the clutch on a Hyundai.They managed to fob me off with"In Spec" until the clutch disintegrated when the first complaint was at the first service.Then informed me to go the legal route when I showed them the complaint and the reports from their workshop.Land Rover has not been on my shopping list for many years exactly because of this poor attitude to warranty problems.There was a faint twinge of hope when they sold out to but that hope was dashed as well.
    Buy a Pajero and you will be happy.

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by silver6933 View Post


    Hmm could you start another thread detailing what you do in the toilet, that would lead her to believe you could CHOKE? eager

    Nothing exciting, just a cough/cold, which coupled with the burst of laughter brought about by the post, made me sound like a dying hyppo.

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by PhlippieV View Post
    But would it be a Land Rover if it didn't force you to employ a bit of DIY?
    I get this, however I view the LR DIY/Fettling/Running Repairs the same way as I view Woolies bread products, they charge a premium price and I still have to finish the baking at home
    Estee = S T = Sean Towlson

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Good read and well done on keeping your blood pressure within safe limits. I suspect Zoneout may have pinpointed the issue. The dealer can sneak in a new transfer case + markup + labour at either the manufacturer or guarantee providers expense it is a score for him. The concept of service is secondary to making money. Then, I'm guessing many that can afford RR's have someone else pick up the tab (often the taxpayer?) or are technically unaware and just pay. Someone confronting a dealer representative with technical argument is relatively rare I think. It seems the default positon is deny, never admit, then try bs. Good products, rubbish support.

    My latest - I was a bit concerned with underbody rust on my 2016 GD6 Fortuner (4x4). SO I ask the local dealer at a service to check and touch up if needed; I will pay if needed. I get a call saying the Toyota rep is there so shoot down only to be re-scheduled then kept waiting half an hour or so. Not good for blood pressure. Anyway, I'm shown the underside of the vehicle which looks better than I thought but the Toyota "rep" calmly says that these vehicles are not meant to be used offroad or even on gravel roads. Well that popped the cork as I do quite a bit on gravel roads and some offroad but eventually we all apologised, retracted and rewound with a compromise that I clean the sand out of the chassis rails (stupid to not have decent drain holes) and Toyota will repaint free. Overall impression; dealers and factory "rep" are useless bs'ers. But I live in hope.

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by faniedup View Post
    Jip, LR sells not because of their dealers, but despite of them
    I live in Zambia, and a few years ago I went to a presentation by the new MD of Toyota Zambia, and he made the comment that everyone in Zambia loves Toyota, but not everyone loves Toyota Zambia - a perception that he intended changing.
    I don't think this perception has hit JLR yet, because they are certainly making a hash of their business image, through inept management and the principle of profit first, bugger the customer.

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Estee View Post
    I get this, however I view the LR DIY/Fettling/Running Repairs the same way as I view Woolies bread products, they charge a premium price and I still have to finish the baking at home
    Just like carbs, LR are not so good for your health...

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by mudgrubber View Post

    My latest - I was a bit concerned with underbody rust on my 2016 GD6 Fortuner (4x4) ........... but the Toyota "rep" calmly says that these vehicles are not meant to be used offroad or even on gravel roads.
    The mind boggles, its like our government and those in charge, I often ask myself if they wake up in the morning, look in the mirror and say to themselves - "I did well,..!!!" this while the place looks more and more like a burst toilet..

    I read somewhere this morning to the tune of - 'We are actually all born ignorant, and some of us work really hard at becoming professionally stupid..'
    Last edited by Marcochezzi; 2020/02/11 at 09:15 AM.
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Sakkie7 View Post
    Good read..Thank you.

    The Jeep WJ series gives the same clunks..groans...binding on the rear wheels due to the Varilock difs in them. Had guys showing up at me where Jeep wants to replace a complete diff because of it.
    Flush the diff oil. Replace with correct oil and ad friction modifier for the clutchpacks.
    Diff is good for another 50K Km for less than R2000-00

    The mind boggles how the Stealers rips people of.
    There you go, the proof is in the pudding - thanks Sakkie..
    Every dog has its day, and those with broken tails have their weak-ends...

    1976 CJ-7, 400CI + Holley EFI, Tera-Low 3,15:1 twin stick, ARB's front & rear, oil leaks & plenty more....

    All my other petrol burners are boring....

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by mudgrubber View Post
    Good read and well done on keeping your blood pressure within safe limits. I suspect Zoneout may have pinpointed the issue. The dealer can sneak in a new transfer case + markup + labour at either the manufacturer or guarantee providers expense it is a score for him. The concept of service is secondary to making money. Then, I'm guessing many that can afford RR's have someone else pick up the tab (often the taxpayer?) or are technically unaware and just pay. Someone confronting a dealer representative with technical argument is relatively rare I think. It seems the default positon is deny, never admit, then try bs. Good products, rubbish support.

    My latest - I was a bit concerned with underbody rust on my 2016 GD6 Fortuner (4x4). SO I ask the local dealer at a service to check and touch up if needed; I will pay if needed. I get a call saying the Toyota rep is there so shoot down only to be re-scheduled then kept waiting half an hour or so. Not good for blood pressure. Anyway, I'm shown the underside of the vehicle which looks better than I thought but the Toyota "rep" calmly says that these vehicles are not meant to be used offroad or even on gravel roads. Well that popped the cork as I do quite a bit on gravel roads and some offroad but eventually we all apologised, retracted and rewound with a compromise that I clean the sand out of the chassis rails (stupid to not have decent drain holes) and Toyota will repaint free. Overall impression; dealers and factory "rep" are useless bs'ers. But I live in hope.

    At the cost of sounding like a broken record, main dealers (of all brands) have lost the ability to repair vehicles.

    They are 'new parts fitting centres'.

    The bigger the part, the better.

    Replace the whole transmissions to cure a whine. New gearbox to cure a leak.

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Estee View Post
    I get this, however I view the LR DIY/Fettling/Running Repairs the same way as I view Woolies bread products, they charge a premium price and I still have to finish the baking at home
    Brilliant analogy!
    Every dog has its day, and those with broken tails have their weak-ends...

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by m0lt3n View Post
    Fyn brag?
    Maybe that came out wrong, don't get me wrong I would love to work on my own Defender if I had more time.

    All I'm trying to say is that some of the younger generation have 2 degrees, like the example given and that took time away from working on his vehicle.

    But to tar all below 40s with the same brush is rubbish.

    But ya that's my 2cents, just took offense to the comment about my generation.
    Last edited by Byron; 2020/02/11 at 09:54 AM.
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Boltpac View Post
    I had the same problems with land rovers went down the road and purchased a Landcruiser never looked back 8 year warranty



    Quote Originally Posted by itamagog View Post
    Buy a Pajero and you will be happy.
    You see, there the thing, I'm absolutely not out of love with the fattie, its JLR that could have done better, Kevin's statement is spot on... I have no real desire to change her for something, cause as sure as I have a pair down there, if I was to purchase something else, mark my words that that something else would break too, or whine, or thump.., and there would be an issue from me, and for sure I would write about it..
    Last edited by Marcochezzi; 2020/02/11 at 11:44 AM.
    Every dog has its day, and those with broken tails have their weak-ends...

    1976 CJ-7, 400CI + Holley EFI, Tera-Low 3,15:1 twin stick, ARB's front & rear, oil leaks & plenty more....

    All my other petrol burners are boring....

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    First off, great work writing that Marco, as always it was a very enjoyable read!

    On the other hot topic I like doing work myself, be that on my house, or my car or what ever else. My attitude is always to try everything once, there are some jobs that I have tried once and decided I would rather pay someone else to do it, and that is also fine. I find there seems to be a growing number of people who don't want to do anything them self, regardless of age. One of the great benefits of doing at least some things yourself is that you gain insight into how it works, which at the very least allows you to not be fooled by BS from someone that wants to take you for a ride.

    My 2 cents regarding hourly rates vs. getting someone else to do it, that applies if you are taking off work to do something for yourself, but hourly rate only applies if you can sell that hour (some can, but not everyone can), what does hold water is if you hate doing things yourself you could be out playing golf or reading a book, and that may still be time better spent than doing something you could pay someone else to do.

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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Marcochezzi View Post
    Landrover – honestly, I expected just a little more from you…

    A short story, because I like telling stories, and since you are here, I guess you like reading them...

    So while this is not intended as a bitch session, it might actually well be, not that I expect that Landrover SA will ever give a flying toss, however in some small way I hope this letter finds its way to John (Pseudonym), the service manager at Landrover branchname Somewhere in Gauteng, between Alberton And Sandton, and to his client liaison officer Marcy (not really sure if this is the correct job title.. but what the hell, we’ll use it, and for the sake of anonymity, another pseudonym)

    Pseudonyms are being used here, since I do not want to get into a legal battle with Her Majesty’s finest, but heck, John, if you read this, you know who you are, and just somehow, I think you will...

    So, my 2014 RR SC 405 Fattie, damn..., heck of a vehicle, genuine, like I smile every time I use it... She makes me feel good in a manly kind of way, and please, genuinely, please don’t pass comment that the fattie is compensation for a small nana or some crap like that, because quite honestly the only one who would know if that is true or false is my wife (and ok quite possibly also my GP since he has worked on some tubes down there..), and my wife sure as hell won’t tell you if it’s true, then no sense going further right, I mean if it is true, well, I guess I would not know better as I still have all the fun, with the long or the short of it so to say……

    Anyway, I digress, however my driving smile became a bit of a grimace a few weeks back...

    Let’s picture the scene since inception... somewhere around the 31K mark I noted a rather annoying rumble on this vehicle, only apparent around 120-140kph, mostly on deceleration, irrespective whether in neutral or in gear.
    LR Branch Somewhere Between Alberton and Sandton changed literally everything that spun under her, short of the motor and gearbox, took ages, as these things do, but I remained loyal and calm, and for what it’s worth, no matter the depth of despair that they might have felt in trying as best they could to resolve my issues, they were not doing me a favour, it’s part of the 5 year contract, if its fu..ed, they fix it, it’s called obligation, not favour..

    They never fixed it… I was shirked off after an untold amount of time being told that the noise it makes is now considered standard.. John, the service manager (pseudonym) does that when his back is to a wall, the shirk off thing, it pisses me off, badly, like really really frikking annoys me, because that means that you are taking me for granted, or classifying me an idiot, which while I might have some issues, I am no idiot, but then hey, who am I but a mere annoying pimple on the arse of a giant somewhere between Alberton and Sandton right…

    His statement of “acceptable standard” makes me laugh though as they sure as hell accepted and attempted the repair by changing literally everything (I’m repeating myself here) that spins, so the little pip residing beetle must have pulled a lever in the collective Landrover technical team brain, because lets be serious, who the f..k is going to fork out that kind of money undertaking a repair that is not necessary since the symptom is not a symptom but a functional norm…

    Around the 38 or 39K mark I returned to them, swallowed my pride and stupidly (yes, I am prone to be stupid from time to time) ignoring the fact that the initial rumble in the jungle repair still rumbled in the jungle, took it upon myself to explain to the self-same John (Pseudonym) that now the transfer case clunks, and thumps, and chatters, and groans. This only happens in a sharp turn, from standstill.

    However, what I did do, is research the symptom, as neither my 302SC or 322SC did the same thing, despite both having had much much much higher mileages...

    Turns out there is a LR technical bulletin out there (I have the copy) to do with this very symptom, got to do with the transfer case fluid and clutches in the case binding etc etc...

    The simple solution to all this is a fluid double flush, plus the upload of some mystical mystery LR software, ‘cause goodness knows if you do not include that software the vehicle will implode, whilst you are on the N1 trying to prove to a nation that she gets to 225…

    “Yes”, agreed John (Pseudonym), you are quite correct, in fact we at branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton employ a Tecchie (not being derogatory here, I’m also a Tecchie..) whose sole purpose is to take care of these faults, often we take it up a level and change clutch packs as well if so required….

    So I guess, possibly mistaken though, that this fault is a hell of a lot more common than what is imagined, since they employ the Tecchie for the sole purpose thereof…….

    So, book her in, somewhere around March last year… Go back 3 or 5 days later (memory is vague at my age...) to collect the fattie, now sporting a brand brand brand new transfer case, not reconditioned mind you, brand new, no double oil flush in the original box, brand new...!!

    “Why??” I asked..

    ‘Cause it’s easier and under warranty...

    Jeez, imagine that, changing a transfer case is easier than a double flush and arbitrary data upload..., anyway, who am I to complain about how JLR chooses to burn Her Majesty’s money

    ————————————-


    That was March / April last year

    June 2019 the vehicle falls out of her 5-year plan...

    July / August vehicle calls for service, time mind you, not mileage, sh1t she barely had 40K on her, if that…

    So I change oil, oil filters, air filters… me, not branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton, me, and by the way thanks again MikeBob for your kind sponsorship, it is not forgotten!!

    Fast forward January 2020, and the transfer case clunk returns, first not much, by end January she was literally dragging her arse around every tight turn.

    So off I go to LR branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton, on a Saturday mind you, only to find Marcy (pseudonym) the service client liaison officer willing to help...

    I explained the scenario, naturally concerned, to which I was informed that JLR might be willing to help as the transfer case is only 8 or 9 months old, even though the vehicle is out of the 5 year plan, “however”’ she states in a questioning way, “You were supposed to have a service done with us on the vehicle in July – one month after the end of the plan, why did you miss it..??”

    “Actually did not miss it”, I said, “I did however do it all myself, she was out of warrantee and I was technically not obligated to return to you”

    “Well then we cannot help” she replied respectfully...

    “Why?” I asked, “The known transfer case issue has jack to do with the fact that engine oil and filters were changed, jack...”

    “Ya but It’s one car..”

    “That’s like my wife going to the fanny doctor to complain about her failed tooth repair”, I state, “despite the doctor arguing that he had jack to do with her tooth, your reply is equivalent to her telling the fanny doctor, but it’s one body….” (in a roundabout kind of way)

    There was a moments silence….

    “look”, she said, “come back in the new week and have a chat with John the service manager…”

    “Cool”, I reply, and off I went…

    Bet you all know where this is going right, I mean if you made it this far, you might as well read on...

    New week Monday, John says, “no problem, bring her in Wednesday and I’ll see what I can do...”

    Wednesday take her in, dealing with the same Marcy, perfectly professional as one would expect.

    And then the dreaded almost expected silence of the lambs…

    Come Friday afternoon, late, I call and chat to Marcy, “so where the hell is my car?” I ask....

    “look”, she said, “We tried, but there is no way around the non-service issue, sorry, genuine..”

    “So what is the next step?”, I ask

    “So the transfer case needs replacing..

    “Again”, I say, that must be an all time record..

    “Yes” Marcy replies, “and that including 8 bolts excluding labour is R100K..”

    “100K..??”, I repeat, “that’s 2 transfer cases in 9 months, maybe 10 months at a stretch….., 100K??”

    “Yes”, she replied again, “100k…”

    Think about this folks, that’s a 1 with 5 zero’s, R100 000.00, read that, that’s a shedload of somethings, anythings, whateverthings...
    Now that might not be much if you are Zuma or a paid member of his 225 735 strong band of thieves clan, me, I’m really a pretty ordinary bloke, and those 5 zeros count..!!

    “Is my car in one piece”, I ask

    “Yes”, she replies…

    “Cool”, I say, “Leave her be, I’m on the way to fetch her….”

    “But she’s not washed yet”, she replies…

    “No issues there”, I say, “please leave her be”, fearing the wash might land up costing me R2K…

    Get to the dealer branch Somewhere Between Alberton And Sandton Friday afternoon late, it was relatively quiet, John (pseudonym) was attached to his phone, Marcy (pseudonym) beckoned me on sheepishly..

    “I’m sorry”, she stated, “We really did try, but that service thing just got in the way..”

    “Yep”, I say, not wanting to repeat the fanny doctor thing, “However I do not really believe you, you see”, I reply to her obvious surprise / concern / Landrover client Liaison officer possibly fake reaction..

    “The way I see it”, I continued, “Is that you did jack on the car, maybe even less than jack, in fact in all probability your service manager John (pseudonym) probably told you to call me with some arbitrary inflated figure after you ran to him to question what to do next, in order that I just turn around and walk away, and if that is the case it really really annoys me, but of course, it’s all assumption on my part and I will never be able to prove that will I?”

    “I’m really sorry”, she replied..

    “So then that’s it?”, I ask, “Nothing more?”

    “Nope”, she confirms, “That’s pretty much it…”

    “Do I owe you anything for this?”, I ask..

    “Nope”, she replied.. “you are welcome to leave with the vehicle now if you wish, will you need a pass out card??”..

    “Just one question please before I leave if I may”, I ask quietly. “What about the JLR technical bulletin for a double flush on the box, that’s all they ever mentioned you should do, nothing more nothing less, my question to you positioned with all due respect and not being an arse here, why did you or John not even offer me that solution, I mean, you had that option didn’t you, its not like you ‘have’ to change the transfer case, in all reality that was the last and most ridiculous option, the first option was to follow your JLR technical bulletin, which I reminded you of at the very beginning of this little adventure, so you did have another immediate option at your disposal, which all things considered, I would have gladly paid for, since you seemingly had her on a lift already, why did you not offer me that option??..”

    She minced on that for a while, and then replied, “Sir, I hear you, and this time I honestly have no words, I have no answer for you, there’s nothing more I can add to that..”

    How’s that for a reply good people, service level 101 breached, I remember reading a thread a few days back about our shocking service levels and rate of call returns, tell me this does not fit the bill…

    “Thank you for your help” I said respectfully, and left, knocking gently on Johns office window wall panel whilst exiting, he still clutching his phone, offering him a thumbs up in thanks for his efforts, I guess I‘m still old school and I do pay respect..

    Now look, I’m no genius, but transfer cases are just not such complex pieces of kit in my eyes, hell I virtually redesigned my entire ’76 Jeep quadratrac transfer case, the original transfer case mind you, which for what it’s worth holds the title of the world’s first all-aluminium, chain driven, permanent 4wd with centre diff and torsen (similar) style limited slip functionality (Borg Warner..), I could write a book on that case, not to mention the Dana cases I have worked on and modified quite extensively, still all functional, it’s really all meccano ultimately…

    The fatties transfer case is just another chain driven (chain = front only) permanent 4wd transfer case with electronic locking centre diff, the diff being controlled through clutchplates such that they can engage & lock in an instant, while rotating, without having to stop or slow down etc etc etc. They are clutchplates, made of clutch plate stuff, not some form of exclusive product available only to the secret locked and fed through a window technical dept of the JLR transfer case team…

    Yes, I understand that the functionality of those plates might shift through different states of “applied pressure” such that the fatties clever all terrain control system functions as it should, but I’m sceptical in that regard for now, personally I believe It’s either open, or locked, nothing more..

    So what to do, what to do, what to do.…??...

    That was Friday 2 weeks back.. Saturday I go and purchase Land Rover transfer case fluid made of Sperm whale sap and compressed Beeno’s, I describe it as that because if you have smelt the sh1t, you would agree…

    Fattie takes 1,5 litres, I purchase 3 litres, yep double flush maths… 3 litres came to give or take R1 680, including vat…

    Jacked the suspension to max height, ice cream tub under the belly of the beast, cracked open the drain nut-bolt thing and watched the stinky stuff leave the dormitory.. 3 minutes to get to that stage I think, maximum…

    Replaced the drain plug, removed the filler plug and pumped the fresh sperm whale / beenos sap into the inlet, 1,5 litres, probably 3 minutes as well..

    Specs say drive the vehicle for 10 minutes and then repeat the drain – fill thing…

    Thought I’d give it a little more time to make use of the fresh fluid so drove for three days on the first replacement fluid… nothing, like nothing, not a pop, not a groan, not a grunt, not a drag, not a thump….

    3 days later I replaced the fluid for the 2nd refill, and yes, its whisper quiet and smooth..

    Now look, I have no doubt that now that I have written this short story, my transfercase will implode in another 2 weeks time, and if that happens, I will take pics and post, however, for now I will let sleeping Sperm whales lie..

    Have since then chatted to a good mate who has a M3 amongst his arsenal, surprisingly he mentioned the exact thing happens on the limited slip diff on that specific model, when it does you don’t replace the diff, you simply change the BMW Sperm whale oil and drive on until next time.. I mean, Would you believe it, think about how many M3 limited slip differential factories around the world are going bust....

    More research revealed that a fellow in the UK on one of the popular Fattie websites simply replaces the oil on a yearly basis, it’s just not worth being bothered about it, just do it and be done…

    So there you have it.. R100k, R1,6k, bet if the damn thing pukes Ill get it all repaired on my workbench for less than R10k, including a chain for R3k..

    That’s crap service Landrover, like really really crap. Quite frankly, I deserved better, not free, but better, which you were able to provide if you just tried a little harder. Your lack of compassion shines through as arrogant, and I fear this will stand you in poor stead in years to come.

    That day, in my heart, I was truly saddened to have flown your flag, been your customer and supporter of your product..

    Yours truly – A pimple on the arse of a giant, somewhere between Alberton and Sandton..
    Why do people quote the whole post to comment?
    My name is Rainier and I drive a Frotuna.




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  21. #79
    Join Date
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainier Vermaak View Post
    Why do people quote the whole post to comment?
    It greatly increases the amount of scrolling required!

    '12 Audi Q5 3.0 TDi quattro stock standard

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  22. #80
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    Default Re: Landrover - you have truly saddened me..

    Quote Originally Posted by Rainier Vermaak View Post
    Why do people quote the whole post to comment?
    Maybe they are not aware that you can delete between the quote brackets, happens, hell I did that too a few times way back in the early days..
    Every dog has its day, and those with broken tails have their weak-ends...

    1976 CJ-7, 400CI + Holley EFI, Tera-Low 3,15:1 twin stick, ARB's front & rear, oil leaks & plenty more....

    All my other petrol burners are boring....

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