Does a Kuga count as a 4x4?? - Page 6





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  1. #101
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Let's try stick to the facts. The Kuga is an AWD vehicle. It doesn't have a transfer case. There isn't a centre diff that can be locked to split 50/50. The same applies to the Defender and the Lancruisers (80,100, 200) before their centre diff is locked. A Defender is technically an AWD vehicle until the centre diff is locked manually. I owned a Subaru Forester SG, it was able to keep up with some proper 4x4s but it had it's limits, due mainly to it being an AWD vehicle. Yes it happened to have a 50/50 split, but not due to a lockable centre diff. I could drive that car on tarmac no problem. A 4x4 with a locked centre diff won't like that too much

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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Geweet die vraag sal kom. Jaa hy het mos darem b 1ste rat wat se ratio gelykstaande is aan lowrange.
    Quote Originally Posted by Uys View Post
    So the 8 speed Amarok is not a 4x4?
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  3. #103
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Amarok is a LDV with 4x4 capabilities.
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  4. #104
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by JohanMaree View Post
    Amarok is a LDV with 4x4 capabilities.

    Family got a 4x4 route that the Safari 4x4 did for the show with the Amaroks . One day on the route a guy try to do the route with well known 4x4 with bigger wheels and low range but older model without all the electronics stuff. He failed at the first grade 5 obstacle.
    These soft 4x4ís like the Kuga and rest will surprise you with 4x4 capabilities.

  5. #105
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Nie almal Se grade5 is meer grade 5...
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  6. #106
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by Reenen View Post
    Nie almal Se grade5 is meer grade 5...
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  7. #107
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    [QUOTE=Rojas;4299853]Just wondering, I know the Kuga is a cross SUV but has anyone done some offroading with it?

    Not talking about driving on a flat dirt road

    Specifically the 1.6 AWD.[/QUOTE

    UNFORTUNATELY NOT.

  8. #108
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    My thinking is that if a comparative exercise is to be held and it is not limited to stock standard vehicles only, the object of the exercise will be defeated.

    I am sure one can with enough money and the appropriate resources build a thing that can go almost anywhere, similar to the American Monster Trucks that did shows here last year.

    I know the following may be off topic, but the point I want to make is "horses for courses" I have had a Land Rover 110 Defender and now drives a 4x4 D4D Fortuner. Looking at drive train specifications they compare as follows: Both have full time four wheel drive with a transfer case with low range and a central differential that can be locked. The Fortuner uses indepenent front suspension and a diff lock at the rear, whereas the Land Rover uses a solid front axle without axle diff lockers.

    I will choose the Fortuner almost any day, especially when four elderly occupants travels together. Those reclining rear seats is a winner. Conversely turning circle and road holding being two major issues. At speeds above 110 the Land Rover is not everybody's cup of tea, wheras the Fortuner cruises effortlessly at speeds way above the speed limit. However, the saying "when the going gets tough the tough gets going" applies here. Where axle articulation and climbing over obstacles becomes par for the course I know which one to choose. No wonder the Unimog's safe cruising speed is a mere 80 kph.

    I am led to believe th Toyota RAV is outstanding on sand. If I stayed near the Namibian coast or dunes I would definately have considered one. Horses for courses?
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  9. #109
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by JCMostert View Post
    Here is a nice clip about the difference between 4x4 and all wheel drive. The Kuga must be an all wheel drive.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHMDtEPeuQM
    Perfectly explained !!

  10. #110
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by JCMostert View Post
    Here is a nice clip about the difference between 4x4 and all wheel drive. The Kuga must be an all wheel drive.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHMDtEPeuQM
    The gentleman bases his comparison on a very very generalised ideas.

    He does make one error though.
    He claims that a 4x4 is heavier on fuel than a 4x2 because all 4 wheels are driven.

    The fuel consumption difference between a 4x2 and a 4x4 / AWD is not due to the fact that all 4 wheels are driven.
    If that was true, a 4x4 driven in 4x2 would be much more fuel efficient, which we know is not true.
    There was a controlled experiment (which I can't find), which showed that a 4x4 Mitsu bakkie was in fact slightly more fuel efficient in 4x4 than in 4x2.

    The fuel consumption increase is most likely more due to the additional weight.
    Last edited by 4eTouareg; 2020/01/13 at 12:36 PM. Reason: Got my 4s and 2s mixed up!
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by 4eTouareg View Post
    The gentleman bases his comparison on a very very generalised ideas.

    He does make one error though.
    He claims that a 4x4 is heavier on fuel than a 4x2 because all 4 wheels are driven.

    The fuel consumption difference between a 4x2 and a 4x4 / AWD is not due to the fact that all 4 wheels are driven.
    If that was true, a 4x4 driven in 4x2 would be much more fuel efficient, which we know is not true.
    There was a controlled experiment (which I can't find), which showed that a 4x4 Mitsu bakkie was in fact slightly more fuel efficient in 4x2 than in 4x4.

    The fuel consumption increase is most likely more due to the additional weight.
    When the Audi Quattros came out at first one of their features highlighted was more efficient fuel consumption. I can recall an argument where it was stated that four wheels propelling itself was more fuel efficient then when two of them needs to be propelled by the grip of the other two.
    Last edited by Poen; 2020/01/13 at 01:28 PM.
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  12. #112
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by Poen View Post
    When the Audi Quattrs came out at first one of their features highlighted was more efficient fuel consumption. I can recall an argument where it was stated that four wheels propelling itself was more fuel efficient then when two of them needs to be propelled by the grip of the other two.
    Interesting

    With all wheel drive there are more mechanical parts that has to be driven, there is more weight I suppose, so in other words there is a fine balance between the "grip" of the other two and additional weight / added weight and mechanical components.

    If you take a Bakkie for example, the 4x2 variant I have always thought would probably be more fuel efficient than the 4x4 variant. I still am of the opinion but maybe its is because of the heavier components in more heavy duty vehicles vs those on more refined cars like Audi's?
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by Pietsweis View Post
    I still am of the opinion but maybe its is because of the heavier components in more heavy duty vehicles vs those on more refined cars like Audi's?
    The 4WD components in my Touareg are much more robust & heavy than eg those of a Amarok (to protect myself from the flames, I will choose two examples from the same stable).
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  14. #114
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by Pietsweis View Post
    Interesting

    With all wheel drive there are more mechanical parts that has to be driven, there is more weight I suppose, so in other words there is a fine balance between the "grip" of the other two and additional weight / added weight and mechanical components.

    If you take a Bakkie for example, the 4x2 variant I have always thought would probably be more fuel efficient than the 4x4 variant. I still am of the opinion but maybe its is because of the heavier components in more heavy duty vehicles vs those on more refined cars like Audi's?
    My guess is that under ideal conditions the two wheel drive will come out on top, but as conditions deteriorate as for which the all wheel drive was designed, like snow, sand, gravel and anywhere where wheel slippage is paramount the scales will swing.
    Last edited by Poen; 2020/01/13 at 03:52 PM. Reason: mistake
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  15. #115
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Are all Kuga in South Africa AWD, many of the ones in Europe are 2WD and you have to look for the driveshaft to tell the difference as no badging?

  16. #116
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    A quick run down of the common misconception of AWD vs 4x4:

    The confusion comes about as there are a variety of different differential technologies in the world.

    Every permanent 4 wheel driven vehicle needs to deal with axle wind up between the front and rear axles.

    The two most common solutions to this are either central viscous differential or a Haldex awd system.

    Cost is obviously a factor between these two systems but the other major advantage is that a Haldex system uses no center differential so the space consumed along the transmission tunnel is significantly reduced and as such you get a much larger cabin with more rear leg-room. Due to this advantage it is the system that almost all awd hatch-backs and small SUVs use and is the most common form of AWD, there are of course exceptions.

    Vehicles fitted with a transfer case can disengage the front axle for tar driving and as such do not need a system to deal with the axle wind up mentioned above. Some of these vehicle add a viscous differential between the transfer case and the drive shafts, the mitsubishi super select system is a good example of this. Transfer cases also give the reduction gearing that allows for proper engine braking and the low speed high torque outputs we all love.

    If your vehicle does not have the ability to disengage 4wd and you do not have low range ratio available, it is almost guaranteed you are running a Haldex AWD system.

    A Haldex system has many different tiers and upgrades, VW and Audi have developed the technology to the point of perfection for most terrains. The torque split is usually fixed but the rear diff can be upgraded and modified depending on the intended application, the system handles the axle wind up by using a Limited Slip Differential to disengage and re-engage the back axle as and when wind up or binding is detected.

    When looking for a 4x4 it is crucial to identify the system you are purchasing, as each has very different components and weak points.

    4x4 and AWD have nothing to do with Locking diffs and Terrain Response (Wheel Braking systems), that is more to do with Solid Front Axles vs Independent Front Suspension.

    I have tried to keep this high level and not dive into details, please excuse certain generalizations, I just didn't see a clean enough explanation of AWD vs 4x4 browsing through.

    Please see the picture of a Haldex system below for reference, note there is no additional drive line space required, it is ideal as an upgrade for a FWD platform.

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    Last edited by AndrewDickerson; 2020/01/14 at 11:51 AM.

  17. #117
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by B Murr View Post
    Are all Kuga in South Africa AWD, many of the ones in Europe are 2WD and you have to look for the driveshaft to tell the difference as no badging?
    No badge means 2WD (FWD). The AWD models have the badge
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  18. #118
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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    I thought it is an SCV

    Spontaneous combustion vehicle



    Quote Originally Posted by Rojas View Post
    Just wondering, I know the Kuga is a cross SUV but has anyone done some offroading with it?

    Not talking about driving on a flat dirt road

    Specifically the 1.6 AWD.

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    Default Re: Does a Kuga count as a 4x4??

    Quote Originally Posted by uri View Post
    I thought it is an SCVSpontaneous combustion vehicle
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