AT Sidewall Durability





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  1. #1
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    Default AT Sidewall Durability

    Is there any baseline measurement for tyre sidewall durability or damage resistance? All options have 2 ply sidewalls except for BFG and DunlopAT3G with have 3 ply.

    Does this mean that all 2 ply sidewalls are made equal or are some stronger than others?

    Reading through almost all threads about AT tyre options, I've noticed lots of comments made about the sidewall durability of specific tyre models e.g. "tyre xyz has a very soft sidewall and damages easily". I realise this is largely based on personal opinion so not really a good measure of reality.

    Good example is that the Bridgestone Dueller AT D697 has often been criticized for being at the low end of the tyre spectrum for any kind of offroad capability. The set on my Fortuner have done over 60,000km, which included 5000km + trip up the West Coast's lesser traveled tracks into and around the Richtersveld, running at 1bar most of the way, very heavily laden vehicle. Also done almost every technical (grade 3 and above) 4x4 trail the Western Cape has to offer. The only problems I've ever had were punctures which in both cases were nails picked up in Cape Town CBD and on the N2 somewhere near Peregrine farmstall in Grabouw.

    So, now that it's time to replace the Dueller 697's (which have been discontinued) I'm trying to understand which tyres would do as well if not better than them. Shortlist so far is:
    • General Grabber AT3
    • Pirelli Scorpion AT-PLUS


    Plenty of comments about the Grabber's having soft sidewalls. Are they really that soft, and are they any less strong than the Dueller 697's?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    My suggestion is to go for the tyre what you can afford with the highest load index, I am not sure how the Load Index affects your sidewall durability but it does mean that the tyre is designed to handle higher loads.

    Naturally, picking up damage by nails or sharp stones etc. is unpredictable so this isnít often a gauge of the tyre strength but rather pure bad luck
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  3. #3
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    LT spec apparently also has tougher sidewalls

    https://www.4x4community.co.za/forum...-LT-spec-tires
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  4. #4
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    I destroyed 2 General Grabber AT3's in a day during some play time on a trail ride. MAXXIS have been my best tyres yet.
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    I had good service from bridgestone duelers AT on construction sites. Very few side wall punctures. Geolander AT were also good. Dunlop AT1, Maxxis and continental LX are the worst. That's now for my daily drive, all other vehicles I use BFG.
    Last edited by JLK; 2019/12/17 at 04:01 PM.
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    LT makes a big difference.

    I have had LT AT Hankooks and non LT. Difference is night and day. But you pay for that difference.

    And you can also feel the difference in tyres even if they have the same ply rating. Probably due to the composition of those ply.

    Check out the SA4x4 tyre review when they do the tyre sidewall puncture test.
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by Walnut View Post
    LT makes a big difference.

    I have had LT AT Hankooks and non LT. Difference is night and day. But you pay for that difference.

    And you can also feel the difference in tyres even if they have the same ply rating. Probably due to the composition of those ply.

    Check out the SA4x4 tyre review when they do the tyre sidewall puncture test.
    I have Hankook Dynapro Mt rt03 fitted on my Syncro and done some serious gravel roads and rocky terrein in NamibiŽ, Botswana and South Africa without any punctures. The are extremely quiet for a MT! And grip is amazing on and offroad use to have BF GOODRICH KO2 but will fit the same tires again and again! Click image for larger version. 

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  8. #8
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Currently sitting in the exact position. I have Pirelli Scorpions LT spec tyre. They've done 100k km without a single puncture. Done fair amount of trials and dunes. My ideal would be the new pirelli tyre in LT spec, but I cant seem to find it in my size 265/70/17.

    Also busy deciding between Grabber at3 or AT+, the load and speed rating of these two are the same. Will probably end up coming down to looks and price. I have found a cooper at3 LT spec tyre, looks a bit more pricey, but might just go this route for piece of mind.
    Last edited by MuKi; 2020/01/08 at 04:09 PM.
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  9. #9
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by TwoStroke View Post
    Is there any baseline measurement for tyre sidewall durability or damage resistance? All options have 2 ply sidewalls except for BFG and DunlopAT3G with have 3 ply.

    Does this mean that all 2 ply sidewalls are made equal or are some stronger than others?

    Reading through almost all threads about AT tyre options, I've noticed lots of comments made about the sidewall durability of specific tyre models e.g. "tyre xyz has a very soft sidewall and damages easily". I realise this is largely based on personal opinion so not really a good measure of reality.

    Good example is that the Bridgestone Dueller AT D697 has often been criticized for being at the low end of the tyre spectrum for any kind of offroad capability. The set on my Fortuner have done over 60,000km, which included 5000km + trip up the West Coast's lesser traveled tracks into and around the Richtersveld, running at 1bar most of the way, very heavily laden vehicle. Also done almost every technical (grade 3 and above) 4x4 trail the Western Cape has to offer. The only problems I've ever had were punctures which in both cases were nails picked up in Cape Town CBD and on the N2 somewhere near Peregrine farmstall in Grabouw.

    So, now that it's time to replace the Dueller 697's (which have been discontinued) I'm trying to understand which tyres would do as well if not better than them. Shortlist so far is:
    • General Grabber AT3
    • Pirelli Scorpion AT-PLUS


    Plenty of comments about the Grabber's having soft sidewalls. Are they really that soft, and are they any less strong than the Dueller 697's?
    I had Pirelli Scorpion (old type) and Goodyear Adventure. Both sets gave me puncture free Km's with about 40% gravel roads, including the odd rocky 4x4 trail. In my experience the three factors that contribute most to punctures are. 1) lack of anticipation, not avoiding rough patches, dongas, sharp rocks etc. 2) Speed: higher= more punctures, 3) combination of tyre pressure and load. And then only in fourth place is tyre choice. I am not saying fit HT tyres but most AT tyrer will be fine for my driving style, as a result I fitted Dunlop AT3m tyres 5000km back, well within my budget. For the price of 4 Grabbers I was able to get 5 Dunlops and do 5 tyre rotation. In theory I will be able to get 20% better millage, only time will tell.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by AWJS View Post
    I had Pirelli Scorpion (old type) and Goodyear Adventure. Both sets gave me puncture free Km's with about 40% gravel roads, including the odd rocky 4x4 trail. In my experience the three factors that contribute most to punctures are. 1) lack of anticipation, not avoiding rough patches, dongas, sharp rocks etc. 2) Speed: higher= more punctures, 3) combination of tyre pressure and load. And then only in fourth place is tyre choice. I am not saying fit HT tyres but most AT tyrer will be fine for my driving style, as a result I fitted Dunlop AT3m tyres 5000km back, well within my budget. For the price of 4 Grabbers I was able to get 5 Dunlops and do 5 tyre rotation. In theory I will be able to get 20% better millage, only time will tell.
    Spot on with your comments...

  11. #11
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by Nico Steenberg View Post
    I have Hankook Dynapro Mt rt03 fitted on my Syncro and done some serious gravel roads and rocky terrein in NamibiŽ, Botswana and South Africa without any punctures. The are extremely quiet for a MT! And grip is amazing on and offroad use to have BF GOODRICH KO2 but will fit the same tires again and again!
    I have the LT version of the Dynapro MTs on the Jimny and I completely agree with everything you said.

    It will have to be on exceptional tyre that will make me switch again. Used Gealander ATs before, not bad, but the Hankooks are miles ahead. With the light weight of the Jimny the ride is a bit harsher, but I use the Jimny for offroad, not to nurse my kidneys.
    Cobus
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  12. #12
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by jab2 View Post
    I have the LT version of the Dynapro MTs on the Jimny and I completely agree with everything you said.

    It will have to be on exceptional tyre that will make me switch again. Used Gealander ATs before, not bad, but the Hankooks are miles ahead. With the light weight of the Jimny the ride is a bit harsher, but I use the Jimny for offroad, not to nurse my kidneys.
    Good choice bud! I really can't think of any other tyre on the market that will make me switch! I've seen on the Australian forums guys that switch from other tyre brands to the Hankook Dynapro MT says that they won't change back to any other tyre.. Close up picture of them Click image for larger version. 

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  13. #13
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    They getting pretty pricey though...R3600 a tyre compared to R2700 for the Grabber X3 I run.....
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  14. #14
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by Walnut View Post
    They getting pretty pricey though...R3600 a tyre compared to R2700 for the Grabber X3 I run.....
    Sure, but look long term. Write off one Grabber and we are nearly even again.
    I have done Boegoeberg 4x4 on Engelsman se Berg near Graafwater on 0.5 Bar pressure. There are a few seriously rocky places (loose sliding rock so no perfect wheel placing possible) and was expecting some sidewall issues. None, niks, nada, not even scratch marks. Last weekend I had a slow leak due to sand in the bead. Saw the tyre was not as perky as the other side, but nowhere near down on the rim. Took the pressure and my gauge's needle did not even move. The sidewall still kept the Jimny's weight up to some extend. Makes me think I may just get away with even lower than 0.4 bar pressure on the sand.
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by Nico Steenberg View Post
    Good choice bud! I really can't think of any other tyre on the market that will make me switch! I've seen on the Australian forums guys that switch from other tyre brands to the Hankook Dynapro MT says that they won't change back to any other tyre.. Close up picture of them Click image for larger version. 

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    That is how a Syncro should look.

    Btw, Syncros was always very good on sand. How do you find the Dynapro MT compared to other tyres? I find they do not float as well as the Geolanders at the same pressure on level sand, but I seem to get higher up on really steep dunes due to the more aggressive tread which gives a bit of extra forward motion.
    Last edited by jab2; 2020/01/19 at 10:03 AM.
    Cobus
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  16. #16
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    Default Re: AT Sidewall Durability

    Quote Originally Posted by jab2 View Post
    That is how a Syncro should look.

    Btw, Syncros was always very good on sand. How do you find the Dynapro MT compared to other tyres? I find they do not float as well as the Geolanders at the same pressure on level sand, but I seem to get higher up on really steep dunes due to the more aggressive tread which gives a bit of extra forward motion.
    Thanks for the compliment on the Syncro

    I used to have Goodyear Wangler's before the BF Goodrich.. The Goodyear was definitely better in the sand the the BF but find the Dynapro better then the two I can't comment on the Geolanders i never used them but read good reviews about them!

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