Engine Braking vs Brakes - Page 2





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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by JLK View Post
    Gearing down save the brakes. Even auto cars lately also gear down when decelerate. Worst I have seen is pressing the clutch together with the brakes when decelerate.
    My Pajero auto gears down when it detects an increase in speed with your foot off the accelerator. It will keep gearing down until the speed remains constant or decrease. I believe that if it was harmful to any of the running gear then it would not have been programmed that way.


    I've also never seen more that 3000rpm during these downshifts.
    Mitsubishi Pajero 3.2 D-ID GLX LWB

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    To see the effects of enging braking vs non engine braking. Find a long stretch of road with little to no traffic. Get to 60km/h take it out of gear and apply just the brakes. You will find it takes a long time to stop. Now redo scenario but leave in gear and apply brakes. Your stopping distance is almost halved. Using the engine to help braking is the sensible thing to do.
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  3. #23
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by Andre Vorster View Post
    When a truck's brakes overheat, it means the driver slipped up in selecting the right gears. You have to be wake-up because things happens quickly.

    Going down a pass and only using your brakes can end badly for you. If your brakes are heated-up already, and you come around a bend and the traffic is at stand-still, chances are your brakes could fail and you will round up a few cars.

    Letting the engine run against compression won't harm it.

    Being sensible about this is difficult to explain, every situation is different.

    My driving style is such that I have done close to 100K km on a set of brake pads on a Nissan Hardbody(diesel). Problem free.

    Best is to push your rig to the limits( when it's safe to do so) and to figure out the parameters yourself.
    And ensure that your brake fluid is moisture free by bleeding/ flushing the brake system from time to time. When water in the fluid system reaches boiling point the brakes are pretty much useless. My dad learnt that the hard way coming down Bulembu pass near Barberton many years back...
    If Force is not the solution, not enough of it was applied....

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    I think especially once you've driven trucks or towed a lot, heavier than venters, then down gearing becomes part of your driving like checking your blindspot before changing lanes. In order to have 100% control over your vehicle you need to be in the right gear, to always be in the right gear you need to gear down while slowing down... It really is part of the process and should not be seen as additional or something else... you gear down as you brake and slow down, except when braking quickly over short distances.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Many VW (Amarok and Vivo) and Audis (A3) autos, will gear down and thus brake automatically when in "S" mode. Obviously not to the same extent as with a forced down gearing



  6. #26
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by WillemT View Post
    I think especially once you've driven trucks or towed a lot, heavier than venters, then down gearing becomes part of your driving like checking your blindspot before changing lanes. In order to have 100% control over your vehicle you need to be in the right gear, to always be in the right gear you need to gear down while slowing down... It really is part of the process and should not be seen as additional or something else... you gear down as you brake and slow down, except when braking quickly over short distances.
    Jip!



  7. #27
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    I travel the malangwane pass between mbabane and Ezulwini often. My previous t1 treg did not gear down automatically and hold to maximum engine braking

    i had to gear down tip tronicaly I would be changing pads twice a year - my newer treg does it automatically- i brake at the beginning of the decent to 60k/h and it keeps it there without the need to brake again. Revs up to 3000 while keeping to speed in 3rd or 4th.

    if you ride a manuals brake down all the way its shuddering at the end of the decent.

    lots of trucks had accidents before the installed a permanent police stop at the beginning of the pass. Trucks brakes cool and are inspected before they can continue

    2011 VW Touareg V.8 TDI
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  8. #28
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    I've done it all my life. Never had any engine or gearbox failure.

    Newer vehicles come with a rev-match feature which will blip the throttle so you can change down gears easier.

    My wife's 86 is doing 94 000kms on the original set of brake pads. This includes a few track days usage.

    With my previous vehicles I've usually owned them for around 5 years each and during that time I'd usually only change brake pads once. (all bought 2nd hand so I cant account for some of the usage on the pads)
    Its not about how fast you are but about how quick you get there...


  9. #29
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by RoelfleRoux View Post
    I most definitely do not gear down for every stop.
    I use the engine to keep speed under control on steep down hills. Brakes can overheat very quickly, which reduces their effectiveness and will eventually lead to complete failure.
    Revving an engine high againts compression is really not good, so I don't allow my diesel engines to run against compression at over 2000rpm. I'd rather brake hard for a short burst to get the speed down and then ask the engine to control the decent as best possible, while allowing the brakes time to cool a little before the next brake pedal push.
    RoelfleRoux sums it up nicely

    It also depends on what Engine and Gearbox combination you have

    My Patrol 4.2 has 6 cylinders at compression ration of 23:1. Together with the big Manual Gearbox it is a very effective way to hold a proper speed on downhills - especially towing. That long descent down Van Reenen's Pass and especially the steep Magoebaskloof descent comes to mind.
    (and not to mention that in tricky 4x4 situations it is the perfect Hill Descent Control)

    I can imagine a small capacity 4cyl with typical turbo engine comp ratios of 16:1 will not make a big impression holding downhill.

    Now, going uphill with the non-turbo 4.2 is a different story...
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  10. #30

    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by RoelfleRoux View Post
    I most definitely do not gear down for every stop.
    I use the engine to keep speed under control on steep down hills. Brakes can overheat very quickly, which reduces their effectiveness and will eventually lead to complete failure.
    Revving an engine high against compression is really not good, so I don't allow my diesel engines to run against compression at over 2000rpm. I'd rather brake hard for a short burst to get the speed down and then ask the engine to control the decent as best possible, while allowing the brakes time to cool a little before the next brake pedal push.
    What Roelf says makes sense.
    I do sometimes use the compression slow down in a quick stop situation though, combined with braking, but not standard procedure.

    My late father taught me that you should use the same gear going down as you would have (on the same gradient in the opposite direction), going up
    Then braking as need needed.


    I have followed his advice over many years and have had no problem.
    Answering the call of the wild is just so much beter than answering the telephone.
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  11. #31
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    [QUOTE=RoelfleRoux;4286258]
    Revving an engine high againts compression is really not good, so I don't allow my diesel engines to run against compression at over 2000rpm. [QUOTE]

    Why? My vehicle red lines at about 4500rmp, so why would it not be a good idea to run against compression at say 3000rpm?
    2013 Discovery 4 SDV6S
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  12. #32

    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by lizardalpha View Post
    Ok cool.

    So it would seem it's mostly for avoiding brakes overheating on passes, and especially whilst towing.

    I have not had any issues driving normally, or even towing a little venter trailer in an auto, I just use the brakes when speed starts exceeding what the speed limit is, but I doubt you need to worry about in those circumstances. I mean I have seen trucks overheating brakes, and I suppose caravaners needs to worry about it as well, but normal car drivers don't.
    When towing anything worth mentioning it is important. Use what you have to make a safer journey.
    Answering the call of the wild is just so much beter than answering the telephone.
    ISUZU KB 280 DT LE NOW POWERED BY THIS AMAZING COMMUNITY
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  13. #33
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    Default Re: Engine Braking vs Brakes

    Quote Originally Posted by lizardalpha View Post
    Ok, so reading on another thread about towing and sport mode and so forth, I read again about using engine to keep speed on a downhill.

    This made me thought about engine braking again.

    Why do people do it? Why not use your brakes? Isn't it cheaper to replace brake pads? Also, what about auto cars? Now, I don't really tow much, so don't have much of a need I suppose. Also, not talking about when 4x4ing where it is needed at certain times.

    So, please educate me a bit.

    My Ranger Auto gears down when I brake for a Stop, it also gears down when it senses that I am braking to control speed down an incline, so did the Audi I had
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