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  1. #61
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Weaver View Post
    It's worth repeating, so I'll repeat it: if you're travelling outside of South Africa, stick with Toyota.
    I suppose Kingsley missed that memo
    05 Mitsubishi Pajero LWB 3.2 Did GLX

  2. #62
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by MarcoP View Post
    I suppose Kingsley missed that memo
    Kingsley had a 4 car support squad.
    2012 Jeep Sahara Unlimited 3.6 V6
    Percivamus

  3. #63
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Kingsley had a 4 car support squad.
    At all times? Not
    05 Mitsubishi Pajero LWB 3.2 Did GLX

  4. #64
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by MarcoP View Post
    At all times? Not
    Are you sure?
    Always think: Could this be sarcasm?

  5. #65
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by patrick79 View Post
    Quick update since I've checked out the first two cars already. The black Pajero is pretty decent. The steering wheel makes a noise while steering, sounds like plastic scratching on plastic. The radio switches off and on when shifting from D to N and back to D. Might just be the tired battery... The paint is a bit worn yes. Otherwise awesome drive and seems very uncomplicated. Almost 200k km might be a bit much tho.

    The Pajero Sport was a flippin waste of time because that car must have been in very serious accident. Both side fixed very poorly. Now that I know I can actually see on the pictures

    Off to Middleburg


    Thanks for all the replies guys!
    The Middelburg car seems to be a good buy. Low kilos for the year model, FSH and price seems ok, I would probably buy this unseen.
    "Stare, pry, listen, eavesdrop. Die knowing something, you are not here long"
    Walker Evans, Photographer

  6. #66
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Thanks for all the help guys. I haven't decided yet but I am tending towards Pajero LWB or Pajero Sport.
    A lot of you recommend Toyota Prado or Fortuner which makes a lot of sense regarding spares outside SA, high resale value etc. However, it's exactly those two cars I do not like at all from a aesthetic point of view, interior and exterior. Sorry Toyota boois . I know those are really good vehicles, I just don't get a smile when I look at them or sit inside of them (LC and FJ are a different story but not in my budget).

    The golden Pajero LWB GLX is in a pretty good condition. Since it's the GLX some convenience features are missing but it still comes with leather and Mitsubishi fitted CC.
    Does anyone know if the sound system of the GLS is much better?

    I also test drove a Pajero Sport 2014 with 75k on the clock. Not too bad either, just VIN and engine nb do not belong together according to firstcheck.co.za

    Everyone have a fantastic weekend!

  7. #67
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Patrick, from a convenience and day to day thing and for what it's worth- bear in mind that the Sport's door opens by swinging up and the Pajero, to the right like a barn door. The rear sill on the Pajero is substantial and I use it to get to the back of the roofrack and preload the unwieldy things. The Pajero also has a huge cavity in the floor where the jump seats live, which can be removed if not used.
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    "Stare, pry, listen, eavesdrop. Die knowing something, you are not here long"
    Walker Evans, Photographer

  8. #68
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by MarcoP View Post
    I suppose Kingsley missed that memo
    Kingsley's early (unsponsored) trips (Cape to Cairo along the Waterways of Africa etc) were all done in Toyotas when he was paying his own way, with limited sponsorship. I first met him in Kenya on Tiwi Beach in 1993 when they were on their way to Ethiopia and he was highly dismissive of our Land Rover because of their perceived unreliability, although he insisted he loved the image (very unreliable - we did 65,000km in two years in what was then a 26-year-old Series IIA and never had a serious breakdown, other than peripherals like shocks and springs breaking).

    I then did the Zambezi from mouth to source trip with him (I left after we had navigated as far as the Cahora Bassa gorge because of time constraints) when our vehicles were sponsored Nissans, and he privately swore never again. Then Land Rover came on board as a sponsor and he has full backup for all his equipment - when we deep-sixed a Mariner outboard in the Cahora Bassa gorge and snapped the prop shaft on our second motor, Mariner flew in replacements to Harare within a day of getting our satphone call.)

    I'm a Land Rover diehard, and used Kingsley's Land Rovers as our land party backup on the Lake Victoria circumnavigation, BUT and it's a big BUT, I drive a 28-year-old fully mechanical 110 V-eight and there's not much on it that I can't fix, or that any roadside bush mechanic can't fix, and most spares are freely available. With a modern vehicle, you will battle to find spares, or mechanics who understand the engines, on anything except Toyotas as they have a very extensive dealer and backup network across Africa. You'll note in some of the posts above that several people have spoken about flying in spares from South Africa for their vehicles - try that when you've broken down at Lealui on the Barotse floodplains, or somewhere near Loiyangalani on the banks of Lake Turkana with anything other than a Toyota or older Land Rover Defender, 110, Series or Discovery I or II.
    Last edited by Tony Weaver; 2019/10/20 at 06:03 PM.
    Tony Weaver

    1991 Land Rover 110 Hi-Line S/W 3.5l V8 carburettor
    Cooper Discoverer STT tyres, four sleeper Echo rooftop tent
    2012 Mitsubishi Outlander.

    Previously Land Rover 1968 SII, 1969 SIIA, 1973 SIII, 1983 Toyota HiLux 2litre, 2006 Land Rover Freelander TD4 HSE.

  9. #69
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    It depends on what you classify as overland travel. To concurr with Tony that the only vehicle spares you will find in isolated Africa are those for Toyota, allow me to quote from personal experience.

    In 2015 on the desperately isolated, 6-7 day eastern Lake Turkana route in the northern territory of Kenya, a front shock pulled right out of its sleeve because of the ferocious corrugations. We were 4 days into the trip and to the south, 3 very long days from the nearest Toyota agent, to the north, goodness knows, probably 5 days.

    We limped into the small mud, Kenyan hamlet of Baragoi where I was directed to a pavement bush mechanic. To my query, yes he had a front Toyota Land Cruiser shock absorber and yes it was new and an official Toyota spare. Further he replied that the roads were very bad and there were lots of Land Cruisers on those roads and it made good business sense to carry that spare. He had few if any other spares in stock. Without a functioning shock it would have taken perhaps a week to limp back to a dealer, provided that further shocks were not wrecked by the suspension imbalance. Any other vehicle would have been a miserable and expensive experience.
    Landcruiser 76SW.

    “Great journeys are memorable not so much for what you saw, but for where you camped”.

    At least "Once a year go someplace you have never been before" Delai Lama.

    Trans East Africa 2015/2016 Trip report http://www.4x4community.co.za/forum/...e16?highlight= from post 315.

  10. #70
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    Smile Re: Toyota spares in Africa because they need to be repaired more often....

    Stan,

    The Patrol ruggedness and suspension strength is legendary. It would not have broken a shock in the first place!!!

    Ha, ha, ha......



    Just had to get in the dig

    Malcolm
    Malcolm van Coller - retired but remained living in Johannesburg (love it here, can find everything you want and need here in Jhb)
    2011 Nissan Pathfinder 2,5 CDi LE Manual (Standard Traction Control plus Front Diff Locker)
    2008 Nissan Patrol 3.0 TDi GL (Packing system, 60lt water tank, std rear locker, LOKKA on front, two 105ah aux batteries on NL system, larger Cirrus intercooler, complete 76mm exhaust system)
    2003 Bushwakka Shorti (extra luggage space for customers on when on safari (with 160 H/Moon Star Gazer RTT and 100lt water tanks)
    Ex 1999 Nissan Terrano 2.7 TDi (Limited Slip Diffs Front and Rear) with Jurgens RTT for Guiding trips
    Ex 2011 Conqueror Supra II for personal camping
    Ex 1995 GQ Patrol GLX 3 speed Auto (disaster that box was!) - Lexus V8 transplant
    Ex 1984 Nissan Safari (Poelies Vehn) 2.8 Stationwagon with 5 speed conversion, rusted like it was paid to rust!
    Ex 1995 Sani 3.0 V6 Exec
    Ex 1994 Venture 2200 with lock diff (Company vehicle) that whet my appetite for overlanding.
    Many 4x4s in National Service (Landies, Jeeps, Willys, Bedfords, Unimogs and Buffels)

  11. #71
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    We did 100,000km around southern Africa in a Toyota Hilux Vigo Double Cab 4.0 V6 from 2016-19 with a family of five. Bought for R140,000, sold for R120,000. Would do it again in a flash - same vehicle. Plenty of spares, accessories, super easy to work on, engine is bulletproof (same as FJ), and heaps of packing space. My 2 cents
    ---
    Dale
    WhatsApp: +27-829324043

    2006 Suzuki Grand Vitara V6 2.7
    2006 Toyota Hilux DC V6 4.0
    2007 Nissan Pathfinder V6 4.0

  12. #72
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    Default Re: Toyota spares in Africa because they need to be repaired more often....

    Quote Originally Posted by mvcoller View Post
    Stan,

    The Patrol ruggedness and suspension strength is legendary. It would not have broken a shock in the first place!!!

    Ha, ha, ha......



    Just had to get in the dig

    Malcolm

    I come a long way with Patrols. When you start comparing I am not so sure that a Patrol is that more rugged than a Cruiser.
    For one many Patrol owners does not even know a Patrol have a chain driven transfer case.

    I know the Patrollers are going to blast me with the huge diff story which is only partially true as it were only the H260 diff were mostly find in the pick-ups. The H260 diff has a huge carry capacity but has the same pinion than the H233B driving the 10.25 crown. Shaft size 38.25mm.
    The glory of the biggest front diff goes to the FJ45 and 60 Cruisers they had the Toyota 9.5'' with 33.27mm shafts vs the Patrol H233 9.0'' crown with 32mm shafts.
    The current 70 series Cruisers have the 9.5 at the back with 33.27 shafts and the 8.0'' reverse cut front diff with 33.27 shafts.
    Yes I know the 8.0'' Toyota reverse cut strips its crown and pinion in some occasions but you really need to push it to break the 8.0"
    I think the only gearbox on the Cruisers that gives trouble is the R151 in the 4.2 1HZ. Still need to find a stronger box than the H151 find in the rest.

    I think the Patrol vs Cruiser argument would go on for many years to come. As said in many posts I were about to buy a Patrol over a Cruiser. My reason for choosing the Cruiser is Patrol future spare availability and limited dealers
    Last edited by grips; 2019/10/21 at 10:42 AM.
    It is not what you buy its what you build.

  13. #73
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Hi folks,

    I just wanted to give an update on my mission finding an overlander.

    I haven't bought anything yet but test driven dozens of cars (mostly D3, D4, PJ Gen4, PJS, Pathfinder).
    Currently, I have got the following cars on my shortlist:

    • PJS, 2.5D, 2013, FSH (engine replaced by Mitsubishi in 2016 - overheating issues ), ~75kkm
    • PJS, 2.5D, 2015, FSH, ~160kkm
    • Pathfinder, 3.0dCi, 2013, FSH, ~110kkm


    All within my budget < R260k.

    However, I have also spent a lot of time checking out overland accessories that I will be needing. That's gonna be another big chunk of $$$ I think that's the reason I have been hesitant to actually purchase one of the above vehicles.

    Yesterday I walked passed a dealership and saw a D3 HSE, diesel, 2008 with 175kkm in perfect condition, one owner, FSH at Land Rover with cam belt done. Price R155k negotiable.
    Will do a test drive today. I know the D3/4 has some issues but somehow the car feels right, it's still a flippin great drive compared to all the other cars. The leftover money I could comfortably spend on roof rack, roof tent, bash plate, air compressor, second battery, etc.


    My observations so far (between the three vehicles):

    PJS
    • Nice and easy drive
    • The least space but still sufficient for two people overlanding
    • Not plenty accessories available in SA but still ok
    • 2013/2014 models with overheating problems
    • Only car with a manual rear diff lock and solid rear axle


    Pathfinder
    • Ample boot space, ~2000 litre when seats folded
    • Drive feels pretty truck-like
    • 2.5dCi and especially 3.0dCi are super strong engines and they seem almost problem free
    • Awesome audio system
    • least fit for off-road, might need a front or/and rear air locker later


    D3/D4
    • Awesome drive
    • Relatively tall vehicle
    • Terrain Response seems to be sufficient
    • Known issues (crank shafts etc)
    • Ample space and features
    • Lots of accessories available



    All the best, Patrick
    Last edited by patrick79; 2019/11/04 at 01:44 PM.

  14. #74
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Do yourself a favor read up on d3 tdv6 crank failures... not worth it!!!
    R90k repair bill and no more confidence to drive anywhere. You will need deep pockets to maintain a D3, my Dad had one and it was a complete money pit.
    Last edited by iLandy; 2019/11/04 at 03:39 PM.
    1985 Land Rover 110 - 300tdi conversion


    It's always more fun on the road less travelled

  15. #75
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by patrick79 View Post
    Hi folks,

    I just wanted to give an update on my mission finding an overlander.

    I haven't bought anything yet but test driven dozens of cars (mostly D3, D4, PJ Gen4, PJS, Pathfinder).
    Currently, I have got the following cars on my shortlist:

    • PJS, 2.5D, 2013, FSH (engine replaced by Mitsubishi in 2016 - overheating issues ), ~75kkm
    • PJS, 2.5D, 2015, FSH, ~160kkm
    • Pathfinder, 3.0dCi, 2013, FSH, ~110kkm


    All within my budget < R260k.

    However, I have also spent a lot of time checking out overland accessories that I will be needing. That's gonna be another big chunk of $$$ I think that's the reason I have been hesitant to actually purchase one of the above vehicles.

    Yesterday I walked passed a dealership and saw a D3 HSE, diesel, 2008 with 175kkm in perfect condition, one owner, FSH at Land Rover with cam belt done. Price R155k negotiable.
    Will do a test drive today. I know the D3/4 has some issues but somehow the car feels right, it's still a flippin great drive compared to all the other cars. The leftover money I could comfortably spend on roof rack, roof tent, bash plate, air compressor, second battery, etc.


    My observations so far (between the three vehicles):

    PJS
    • Nice and easy drive
    • The least space but still sufficient for two people overlanding
    • Not plenty accessories available in SA but still ok
    • 2013/2014 models with overheating problems
    • Only car with a manual rear diff lock and solid rear axle


    Pathfinder
    • Ample boot space, ~2000 litre when seats folded
    • Drive feels pretty truck-like
    • 2.5dCi and especially 3.0dCi are super strong engines and they seem almost problem free
    • Awesome audio system
    • least fit for off-road, might need a front or/and rear air locker later


    D3/D4
    • Awesome drive
    • Relatively tall vehicle
    • Terrain Response seems to be sufficient
    • Known issues (crank shafts etc)
    • Ample space and features
    • Lots of accessories available



    All the best, Patrick

    Glad the search is going well.

    PJS:

    There was an extensive recall on those 2.5 motors that had the overheating problem and Mitsi SA has done a super job from most accounts in replacing with updated motors without questions asked and free of charge.

    Pathfinder:

    I'm not fully clued up here but when I went through the same process as you, and again more recently when my brother purchased the Navara 2.5 dci (which he loves) I found a few problems on that 2.5dci motor most of which are summed up here https://www.steves.co.za/a-few-poten...an-navara-2-5/

    I have always thought the 3.0V6 was a bit of a beast though and most of the research showed it was good. SAC have this https://www.steves.co.za/a-few-poten...an-navara-3-0/

    Do yourself a favour and check out their other common faults threads.

    Cheers

  16. #76
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    Quote Originally Posted by ChasingSunsets View Post

    Pathfinder:

    I'm not fully clued up here but when I went through the same process as you, and again more recently when my brother purchased the Navara 2.5 dci (which he loves) I found a few problems on that 2.5dci motor most of which are summed up here https://www.steves.co.za/a-few-poten...an-navara-2-5/

    I have always thought the 3.0V6 was a bit of a beast though and most of the research showed it was good. SAC have this https://www.steves.co.za/a-few-poten...an-navara-3-0/

    Cheers
    I've had not had any of the issues posted on Steve's website with my D40 yd25 Pathfinder (and it is speedo is reading nearly 190,000 km), with the exception of the first clutch that packed up soon after buying the vehicle. I threw out the DMF flywheel and fitted a solid flywheel and have not looked back.

    Regarding the EGR valve, everybody tells you to fit an EGR blanking plate on just about any diesel vehicle. I did that too and so that issue disappears....

    Still using all of its 140kw and 450 nm.

    Regarding your comment that it rides like a truck...?? You are the first person I've heard that from. It has coils all round and it is general knowledge that a vehicle with coils all round gives the best ride, in SUVs and vehicles in general. It is vehicles with leaf springs at the rear that ride like "trucks". Its general roadholding does not have to stand back for any run of the mill saloon vehicle, and I sometimes drive mine fairly enthusiastically. It just loves fast winding roads, the vehicle's VSC no doubt has a hand in that.....

    Its ride and road holding on dirt is absolutely exemplary, unlike most leaf sprung SUVs...
    Last edited by mvcoller; 2019/11/06 at 11:35 AM.
    Malcolm van Coller - retired but remained living in Johannesburg (love it here, can find everything you want and need here in Jhb)
    2011 Nissan Pathfinder 2,5 CDi LE Manual (Standard Traction Control plus Front Diff Locker)
    2008 Nissan Patrol 3.0 TDi GL (Packing system, 60lt water tank, std rear locker, LOKKA on front, two 105ah aux batteries on NL system, larger Cirrus intercooler, complete 76mm exhaust system)
    2003 Bushwakka Shorti (extra luggage space for customers on when on safari (with 160 H/Moon Star Gazer RTT and 100lt water tanks)
    Ex 1999 Nissan Terrano 2.7 TDi (Limited Slip Diffs Front and Rear) with Jurgens RTT for Guiding trips
    Ex 2011 Conqueror Supra II for personal camping
    Ex 1995 GQ Patrol GLX 3 speed Auto (disaster that box was!) - Lexus V8 transplant
    Ex 1984 Nissan Safari (Poelies Vehn) 2.8 Stationwagon with 5 speed conversion, rusted like it was paid to rust!
    Ex 1995 Sani 3.0 V6 Exec
    Ex 1994 Venture 2200 with lock diff (Company vehicle) that whet my appetite for overlanding.
    Many 4x4s in National Service (Landies, Jeeps, Willys, Bedfords, Unimogs and Buffels)

  17. #77
    Join Date
    Feb 2019
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    Stellenbosch
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    I think the Pathy is a stunning looking car. Agree that with the coil set-up it should drive nicely. My brother reckons his Navara handles really nicely and behaves a bit more like a car.

    If you have Instagram try to send Jan Nieuwenhuizen @jaks_tracks a direct message. He seems to have overlanded quite a bit with both a Pathy and more recently a Pajero Sport. May offer you valuable advice.

    Cheers
    Last edited by ChasingSunsets; 2019/11/06 at 12:31 PM.

  18. #78
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    Default Re: Right fit for an overland newbie

    C'mon, you've got a D3 and D4 on your shortlist and not a Y61 Patrol and your requirement is an overlanding vehicle? You're missing something fairly fundamental here. I'm not even a Patrol owner (athough I do overland with some) and know well the vehicle's reputation and have seen it first hand, as have others on this thread.

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