So, in the near, very near probably, I'm going to be getting a D2 for the trails (up to grade 5) and would also like an option to use it for overlanding. It will be a 2004/5 Td5 with anything between 200-300k km on the clock. Automatic gearbox and facelifted model with the CDL already there.
The goal of this thread is to glean as much information as I can about the ultimate build and what you would do to it to achieve the above purposes. I will be getting a Nanocom of course for diagnostics and more.
So let's have at it and please give your reasoning for the mod. So far, I have the following, with the first few items being maintenance and prevention in their respective order of installation, but open to re-arrange if the justification is right.
Preventative:
EGT Gauge - Madman?
Gearbox filter replace
Gearbox Oil Cooler
Catch can
Injector harness replace - with upgraded part?? Including Copper washes from a 300Tdi.
Upgrades:
Hybrid Turbo or VNT - opinions
Intercooler upgrade
Software Remap
V8 Torque Converter mod
Defender TD5 Transfer Case
Range Rover P38 Autobox replace
Remove MAF or Replace Maf??
Suspension lift - 2" or 4"
Long Travel Shocks
Body Lift - necessary?
Tyres - when they need to be replaced. What's recommended here? 33's or 35's?
Snorkel
Front/Rear/Side bumpers and sliders
Front and Rear Air lockers - please help here
Portal Axles - eventually - if necessary later.
So this also serves as a bit of a wish list. There will be other personal mods made to it during it's lifetime, but the goal is to use this for fun and travels so if any of the above are totally impractical for overlanding, I need to know.
I've had a TD5 on 31" tyres and a V8 on 33s. Some thoughts:
Would very strongly lean towards a V8 for a toy.
Your fuel consumption will go out the window with a lift and big tyres. My V8 went from 7km/l stock to 5km/l on 33s. A built TD5 will probably drink like a stock V8 if not worse.
Add a Defender transfer case, or different diff ratios to your list. I went for Ashcroft heavy duty CW&P and would go this route again. With stock ratios the V8 couldn't pull up a hill at 110km/h because the revs were too low but was good at 120-130. Sometimes you don't want to be rushed though and it becomes a pain
I ran Ashcroft ATB's rather than air lockers. They're cheaper but the main reason was that they just work without any driver intervention. Buy a car with CDL or do a TC change as above to get it. Keep the traction control- it's quite sophisticated and helpful, especially when coupled with ATB's.
2" suspension lift is the highest I would go with a Disco. Beyond that you will have geometry issues affecting steering and the rear prop doughnut needs to be replaced with a UJ. Even at 2" it needs changing often.
Find a car with SLS airbags and keep them. Extra lift on demand or if you get stuck
Do a body lift as well. 40-50mm. Cheap and easy. You need the total of 4", so 2 on the suspension and 2 on the body
You will need to tweak the arches very slightly as well
If you go 35 you will need stronger sideshafts, even lower gearing, more arch clearance. Not sure it's worth the effort
Pic is my V8 on 33s. 13 day build
Last edited by Hagu13; 2019/09/18 at 12:10 PM.
Rob
V8 Defender 90 pickup. Lexus, Spitronics, 33" KL71, beadlocks, +2" Terrafirma, ATB's, 3.75 CW&P, 1.21 TC.
Series IIA 88" pickup
Disco 2 ES TD5
Disco 1 ES 300TDi
Subaru impreza WRX
Porsche Boxster S
Shamrock Cobra 350
MG TF160 VVC ZandF remapped
Buell XB12R
I've had a TD5 on 31" tyres and a V8 on 33s. Some thoughts:
Would very strongly lean towards a V8 for a toy.
Your fuel consumption will go out the window with a lift and big tyres. My V8 went from 7km/l stock to 5km/l on 33s. A built TD5 will probably drink like a stock V8 if not worse.
Add a Defender transfer case, or different diff ratios to your list. I went for Ashcroft heavy duty CW&P and would go this route again. With stock ratios the V8 couldn't pull up a hill at 110km/h because the revs were too low but was good at 120-130. Sometimes you don't want to be rushed though and it becomes a pain
I ran Ashcroft ATB's rather than air lockers. They're cheaper but the main reason was that they just work without any driver intervention. Buy a car with CDL or do a TC change as above to get it. Keep the traction control- it's quite sophisticated and helpful, especially when coupled with ATB's.
2" suspension lift is the highest I would go with a Disco. Beyond that you will have geometry issues affecting steering and the rear prop doughnut needs to be replaced with a UJ. Even at 2" it needs changing often.
Find a car with SLS airbags and keep them. Extra lift on demand or if you get stuck
Do a body lift as well. 40-50mm. Cheap and easy. You need the total of 4", so 2 on the suspension and 2 on the body
You will need to tweak the arches very slightly as well
If you go 35 you will need stronger sideshafts, even lower gearing, more arch clearance. Not sure it's worth the effort
Pic is my V8 on 33s. 13 day build
Awesome - Thanks! Your D2 is what made me settle on 33's rather than bigger. 33's is just fine.
Does the SLS work with coils or separate?
Defender transfer case? Please explain a bit more.
Edit: ATB's are better. Is that in the front and rear?
Awesome - Thanks! Your D2 is what made me settle on 33's rather than bigger. 33's is just fine.
Does the SLS work with coils or separate?
Defender transfer case? Please explain a bit more.
Edit: ATB's are better. Is that in the front and rear?
SLS has an airbag where the coils are on the other models. It's rear only on the D2. There are 3 trim specs in the range. GS with no sunroofs/SLS or ACE. I wouls avoid this one as the ACE is also a good system that gives better onroad handling and better offroad flex. XS has manual sunroofs, part leather seats and SLS. ES is electric everything, leather and SLS. All of mine have been ES spec. But a lot of owners neglected the airbags then the compressor works too hard and burns out, and they convert to coils. So you need to physically look under the car to check. To lift the car you put a spacer under the airbag and recalibrate the height sensors to match your lifted front coils. You get 3 height modes. standard, offroad at the push of a button and extended which is automatic if it thinks it's beached. I think it's a total of 90mm extra in extended. Also great if you load heaviiy because it just levels again when you switch on.
Defender comes stock with 32' tyres, Disco is 29". Rest of drivetrain is very similar. The difference in tyre sizes is compensated for by TC ratios. Check the ratio calculator at Ashcroft transmissions. Disco is heavier than a Defender and it struggles to pull much taller gearing
I have ATBs at both ends. Had rear only on my TD5 but added a second one to the V8 and later moved them across to the Defender
Rob
V8 Defender 90 pickup. Lexus, Spitronics, 33" KL71, beadlocks, +2" Terrafirma, ATB's, 3.75 CW&P, 1.21 TC.
Series IIA 88" pickup
Disco 2 ES TD5
Disco 1 ES 300TDi
Subaru impreza WRX
Porsche Boxster S
Shamrock Cobra 350
MG TF160 VVC ZandF remapped
Buell XB12R
SLS has an airbag where the coils are on the other models. It's rear only on the D2. There are 3 trim specs in the range. GS with no sunroofs/SLS or ACE. I wouls avoid this one as the ACE is also a good system that gives better onroad handling and better offroad flex. XS has manual sunroofs, part leather seats and SLS. ES is electric everything, leather and SLS. All of mine have been ES spec. But a lot of owners neglected the airbags then the compressor works too hard and burns out, and they convert to coils. So you need to physically look under the car to check. To lift the car you put a spacer under the airbag and recalibrate the height sensors to match your lifted front coils. You get 3 height modes. standard, offroad at the push of a button and extended which is automatic if it thinks it's beached. I think it's a total of 90mm extra in extended. Also great if you load heaviiy because it just levels again when you switch on.
Defender comes stock with 32' tyres, Disco is 29". Rest of drivetrain is very similar. The difference in tyre sizes is compensated for by TC ratios. Check the ratio calculator at Ashcroft transmissions. Disco is heavier than a Defender and it struggles to pull much taller gearing
I have ATBs at both ends. Had rear only on my TD5 but added a second one to the V8 and later moved them across to the Defender
Thanks. I've got my eyes on a GS and it's 99% mine and i'm happy with that.
Can I fit aftermarket airbags to assist with load if/when overlanding, etc.?
You can go aftermarket but then they're just helpers to level it when loaded. No extra height for offroading. I've actually done the party trick of beaching it, waiting 30 seconds and driving away. It's great.
The ACE system was a response to the cornering of the D1 that leans like a double decker bus in corners. It uses hydraulic rams to drive her upright so she will corner like a flat car, but offroad it allows huge amounts of flex so it's the best of both worlds. My missus gets scared in my D1 going slowly around corners but is chilled when I drive the D2 at twice the speed
I personally wouldn't buy a D2 without both systems.
THere are still some very nice ones out there. I just got my ES with a winch, steel bumper, 2"lift and snorkel in perfect condition with absolutely everything on the car still working for 65k. Was the personal vehicle of a well known big LR indy owners wife.
Last edited by Hagu13; 2019/09/18 at 02:52 PM.
Rob
V8 Defender 90 pickup. Lexus, Spitronics, 33" KL71, beadlocks, +2" Terrafirma, ATB's, 3.75 CW&P, 1.21 TC.
Series IIA 88" pickup
Disco 2 ES TD5
Disco 1 ES 300TDi
Subaru impreza WRX
Porsche Boxster S
Shamrock Cobra 350
MG TF160 VVC ZandF remapped
Buell XB12R
You can go aftermarket but then they're just helpers to level it when loaded. No extra height for offroading. I've actually done the party trick of beaching it, waiting 30 seconds and driving away. It's great.
The ACE system was a response to the cornering of the D1 that leans like a double decker bus in corners. It uses hydraulic rams to drive her upright so she will corner like a flat car, but offroad it allows huge amounts of flex so it's the best of both worlds. My missus gets scared in my D1 going slowly around corners but is chilled when I drive the D2 at twice the speed
I personally wouldn't buy a D2 without both systems.
THere are still some very nice ones out there. I just got my ES with a winch, steel bumper, 2"lift and snorkel in perfect condition with absolutely everything on the car still working for 65k. Was the personal vehicle of a well known big LR indy owners wife.
If/when a ES with ACE, etc. comes along, I'll snap that one up also but for now, GS it will be. Can you install the ACE on a GS perhaps?
This will be for offroad only / overlanding but will use it if the D4 is in for a service or whatever so will just need to drive more sensibly with it then I guess. Other GS owners I know haven't complained about it that much so not sure it is essential. Unless you only know what you missing when you have experienced it could also ring true.
If/when a ES with ACE, etc. comes along, I'll snap that one up also but for now, GS it will be. Can you install the ACE on a GS perhaps?
This will be for offroad only / overlanding but will use it if the D4 is in for a service or whatever so will just need to drive more sensibly with it then I guess. Other GS owners I know haven't complained about it that much so not sure it is essential. Unless you only know what you missing when you have experienced it could also ring true.
That's Selima. Sounds great... but I don't it so loud.
Big job to retrofit if even possible. Hydraulic pump on the engine, reservoir, pipes, hydraulic rams, ECU
I hear what you're saying about not missing what you haven't experienced, but your D4 doesn't wallow around so you're gonna notice it
Rob
V8 Defender 90 pickup. Lexus, Spitronics, 33" KL71, beadlocks, +2" Terrafirma, ATB's, 3.75 CW&P, 1.21 TC.
Series IIA 88" pickup
Disco 2 ES TD5
Disco 1 ES 300TDi
Subaru impreza WRX
Porsche Boxster S
Shamrock Cobra 350
MG TF160 VVC ZandF remapped
Buell XB12R
Do take note the ZF4 HP22 autobox is a weakling, but you can fit a ZF4HP24 auto (Range Rover P38) without much alterations it is as near a straight swop as you will probably get, the HP22 box is designed to handle max 340nm where the HP24 is designed to handle 550nm. I installed a P38 autobox in my D2 and it was very easy, the only thing I would like to change is the torque convertor I have a P38 torque convertor and it is just too big for the TD5 the 4.0 V8 torque convertor should be fine. I for one only drove manuals and my TD5 is my first auto offroader and would not go back to manual the auto has way more control in extreme situations.
I went the VNT turbo route because 1. it spools up the quickest and 2. Is best for keeping your egt's lower (mine is about 150 deg. C lower than the standard turbo).
Those who say the TD5 will have a bad fuel consumption have never been more wrong! My TD5 with 2" lift, 32" Mud terrains front and rear offroad bumper and winch gives me 9km/l while towing a 7 foot trailer with 7 people in it( and that is with the TD5 alive map)
I go where any D2 V8 goes even in the dunes while using half the amount of fuel
While changing the injector loom change the injector copper washers but use 300tdi copper washers and Viton o-rings and reset injector plunger height accordingly.
Install a water level sensor in water bottle, if you loose water quickly your water temp sensor will not show its overheating or get a oil temp sensor which is best IMHO
Do take note the ZF4 HP22 autobox is a weakling, but you can fit a ZF4HP24 auto (Range Rover P38) without much alterations it is as near a straight swop as you will probably get, the HP22 box is designed to handle max 340nm where the HP24 is designed to handle 550nm. I installed a P38 autobox in my D2 and it was very easy, the only thing I would like to change is the torque convertor I have a P38 torque convertor and it is just too big for the TD5 the 4.0 V8 torque convertor should be fine. I for one only drove manuals and my TD5 is my first auto offroader and would not go back to manual the auto has way more control in extreme situations.
I went the VNT turbo route because 1. it spools up the quickest and 2. Is best for keeping your egt's lower (mine is about 150 deg. C lower than the standard turbo).
Those who say the TD5 will have a bad fuel consumption have never been more wrong! My TD5 with 2" lift, 32" Mud terrains front and rear offroad bumper and winch gives me 9km/l while towing a 7 foot trailer with 7 people in it( and that is with the TD5 alive map)
I go where any D2 V8 goes even in the dunes while using half the amount of fuel
While changing the injector loom change the injector copper washers but use 300tdi copper washers and Viton o-rings and reset injector plunger height accordingly.
Install a water level sensor in water bottle, if you loose water quickly your water temp sensor will not show its overheating or get a oil temp sensor which is best IMHO
Thanks for the helpful info. I've added the P38 box to the list. I'll update the OP shortly.
What is the benefit of the copper washers for the injector harness?
Also, I'll probably do hybrid first and monitor. Then upgrade to VNT at a later stage and yes, definitely agree with the fuel consumption figures you state. I've heard similar things from others so this confirms it.
Thanks for the helpful info. I've added the P38 box to the list. I'll update the OP shortly.
If you would like the know how just send me a pm as I did the tranny swop myself and wasn't much to it
What is the benefit of the copper washers for the injector harness?
The copper washers I am refering to is those that seal your injector to the cylinderhead so therefore you will have to remove the injectors to do that but do remember that you install the same injector where you took it out as the injectors are calibrated and set to that specific cylinder on your ECU. The 300tdi copper washers is just a bit thicker and creates a better seal, but remember to loosen all your injector setting screws and then reinstall everything. If you can heat the washer till they are glowing hot and then cool them down before installing is even better as that softens the copper even more for a better seal.
Also, I'll probably do hybrid first and monitor. Then upgrade to VNT at a later stage and yes, definitely agree with the fuel consumption figures you state. I've heard similar things from others so this confirms it.
The VNT setup isn't that expensive, if you can get a Navara 2.5 VNT turbo its pretty straight forward to install. I bought a secondhand one for R3K and just changed the exhaust flange on both sides accordingly took me a day to do the turbo swap.
Ultimate Disco2 Td5 Build
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Originally Posted by Hagu13
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