Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA - Page 3





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  1. #41
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    The 7AGE is a mod to increase torque (1800cc)and it does so nicely they don't rev like the standard 4age. dump the carbs, find a set of standard throttles (around 2K) basic management system and you are away
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  3. #42
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Quote Originally Posted by wicd View Post
    but... But we saw it on a toyota add

    too soon? ;d
    ;d;d;d;d

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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    ek sal vir Isak van DynoTech aanbeveel vir die Management. Skakel hom, dalk het of kan hy jou uitsort met throttles. Brackenfell gelee

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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Quote Originally Posted by Hamtheman View Post
    The 7AGE is a mod to increase torque (1800cc)and it does so nicely they don't rev like the standard 4age. dump the carbs, find a set of standard throttles (around 2K) basic management system and you are away
    That's my 3rd plan.

    1st plan: Old school mechanic (tjommie se tjommie) to sort out carbs
    2nd plan: Goch and Cooper ( more reputable than tjommie se tjommie ) to sort out carbs
    3rd plan: Go as standard as possible on the silvertop head
    4th plan: Go as standard as possible on 7A block??
    It is a 1800 block with mild top (7A) with enough torque.
    5th plan: Abort project

    The goal is just to get it reliable, not to get as much performance out of it as possible. But as is, i'm not too sure what fuel consumption would be. It would be an issue if it's heavier than my V6 Prado. ( 2 x 40mm Webers ).

    -Carbs should not flood/starve the engine on steep inclines, if float levels are correct.

  6. #45
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Nice little weekend toy you get there. If you aren't happy with the motor then why not also look at the 5L motor that came in 4x4 diesel condor or even the 2.4 petrol version.

  7. #46
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Is it running yet?

    Nothing a good dose of quickstart and a tow start can't fix.

    Is it at least getting spark?
    Last edited by Skylark; 2019/09/06 at 12:19 AM.

  8. #47
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    Post Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Thing about carbs is people start fiddling with no clue of what they are doing or what they expect from the result.
    First you need to understand how a carb works. The different circuits like idle, mid range, top end. Also the function of power valves, acceleration pumps and the jetting.

    You does not change or turn set screws before you are 100% sure what the problem is. If you find the problem you must be sure that, that what you plan to do is the correct thing. You just do not change jets without reading the spark plugs.

    Good example is my youngest. He rebuilded the engine on his Kawasaki KX 125. The engine were a little down on power. Long story short I have helped him to set up the engine 3 years ago and it were in top tune.
    When I arrived home he told me he had a look at the specs and changed all the settings of the carb back to stock. My first question were are you sure it is the carb. He said yes. I leave him to that. So for three days he tries to get the performance back to normal with no luck. He turns too me for help. I have a way to let them struggle and find their own solutions for problems. This is the best way to learn.

    Opened the carb and find that he put back all the original jets. I just stopped there. Ask him why he changed back the jets. Left him with a hint. Ask him a simple Question, what about height above sea level and the performance pipe that were on the bike. He sort of give a shy smile. When I walked away I told him it were not the carb right from the start. So he put back all the jets that we put in 3 years ago. Now the little 125 were even running worst. He came to me and said. Sien Pa ek het mos gesÍ dit is die carb.
    Said then you were right. But where are the problem? low down, mid range or top end. He said right through the power band.
    I now sort of start to enjoy his struggle. Told him to go to the manual and make sure he does exactly know how the carb works. He took it out and strip the whole thing checking out every port and circuit. Reassemble and start the bike. By now lots of kicking to get it started running even worst than before.

    Came to me very down hearted and said that he does not know anymore. I asked him did you check or changed the spark plug.
    He said no, I only said O and smiled.
    Few moments later there were a sweet running 125 engine.

    My Mazda B2.2 did a million km. Have never touched that carb other than setting air and idle after a service.
    Most carb related problems I have found were that they were tuned moertoe.
    Last edited by grips; 2019/09/06 at 06:44 AM.
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  10. #48
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Dankie vir al die raad.

    I'll take it to the friend and ask him if he are capable, or if I should take it to a dyno guy. Goch & Cooper or Dynotech.

    Don't know if it will start/not. I'll see this afternoon - got an A-frame....

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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    oK, Engine is running. 1st piston/plug is flooded and engine needs to warm up for about 3 minutes due to no choke. Then it can be revved and runs smooth after that.

    Would work even better if we can get the engine more level.
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  12. #50
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Quote Originally Posted by Swerkater View Post
    oK, Engine is running. 1st piston/plug is flooded and engine needs to warm up for about 3 minutes due to no choke. Then it can be revved and runs smooth after that.

    Would work even better if we can get the engine more level.
    Get some covers on those cambelts, looking for trouble running then exposed like that
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  14. #51
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Quote Originally Posted by Swerkater View Post
    That's my 3rd plan.

    1st plan: Old school mechanic (tjommie se tjommie) to sort out carbs
    2nd plan: Goch and Cooper ( more reputable than tjommie se tjommie ) to sort out carbs
    3rd plan: Go as standard as possible on the silvertop head
    4th plan: Go as standard as possible on 7A block??
    It is a 1800 block with mild top (7A) with enough torque.
    5th plan: Abort project

    The goal is just to get it reliable, not to get as much performance out of it as possible. But as is, i'm not too sure what fuel consumption would be. It would be an issue if it's heavier than my V6 Prado. ( 2 x 40mm Webers ).

    -Carbs should not flood/starve the engine on steep inclines, if float levels are correct.
    This is a good plan, start with the simplest solution. Carbs work very well when set up correctly and a choke will help with starting but it does take some finessing and each car usually has their own special combo to hit that sweet spot.

    With my old Golfs that ran 40s and 45s I used to turn on the ignition, wait for the fuel pump to prime, then give the accelerator 3 pushes before starting. That normally worked well but of course you need to wait for things to warm up nicely.

    I would advise that you remove the carbs and have them cleaned and rebuilt by a reputable carb guy before you spend too much time setting them up. Air filters are also highly advisable. During the rebuild you can already ask the carb guy to try and set them up for your motor.

    This set up looks like it could be a lots of fun, don't listen to the naysayers, that motor should be able to deliver more than enough torque compared to the standard motor.

    Having said all that, the standard 20V throttle bodies will probably be a much better set up for a daily driver. Carbs are definitely more for nostalgia than anything else because throttle bodies will almost always out perform carbs in almost all conditions in general. BUT carbs sound and 'feel' amazing, especially a rough old pair of Webers!
    Last edited by chopwet; 2019/09/10 at 11:46 AM.

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  16. #52
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Quote Originally Posted by chopwet View Post

    Carbs are definitely more for nostalgia than anything else because throttle bodies will almost always out perform carbs in almost all conditions in general. BUT carbs sound and 'feel' amazing, especially a rough old pair of Webers!
    Fuel injection is more refined than a carb. Most American engine builders still prefers carbs. You make serious HP with carbs.
    On the LS Chevy Lumina the final and most powerful mod what they call the Nascar mod they strip of the fuel injection and fit a monster carb.

    EFI is more reliable and easier to maintain than carbs but do not underestimate carbs when it comes to make HP.
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  18. #53
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Ok......... Goch & Cooper was a complete waste of time.

    They can't help with Webers and quoted R30 000 for a fuel injection system

    They say that there is no parts and they can't work on the Webers and "need rubbers between carb and engine, because the engine vibrations cause bubbles in the carburettors."

    At this stage the car start very well, after following one of your tips ( let pump prime, pedal 3 times and start = choke ).
    But then after 20 minutes, the no1 sparkplug is flooded with petrol. And overall overfueling with petrol fumes all over rev range.

    I've put it back on the market @ R45 000 and hope to get some money back.

    In the mean time I'm looking for someone to open up the carbs, check if a service kit is needed and to do the tuning. (And reading up on how to do it myself.) Parts is no problem and anything is still available, but might need to be imported.

  19. #54
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Maar dit bly maar 'n oulike jepie, en ek hoop maar steeds om hom reg te kry.

    Sal 'n lekker jag-karretjie wees. Daar is ook 'n opsie om dit 'n goedkoop, ligte 4x4 bakkie te maak.
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  20. #55
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    If you genuinely like the vehicle I'd hold your horses till someone competent with Webers and those engines can take a look at it.

    It probably just needs some minor work to be in acceptable running order, then you'll be better informed to make a choice to keep or sell and if it is to sell you can ask a higher price as you have a known entity Vs now its running but that's it.
    Last edited by Skylark; 2019/09/19 at 09:37 AM.

  21. #56
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Yep, sad to hear, but carbs are becoming a lost science.
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  22. #57
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Cheap small 4x4 truck / bakkie option.
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  23. #58
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    I cannot believe what n read here. Nobody can sort out carbs any more. Really the simplest form of fueling.

    In this case maybe just jetted wrong for the application. A low tech carb too high tech for today's high tech youngsters
    Last edited by grips; 2019/09/20 at 06:14 AM.
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  25. #59
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    Quote Originally Posted by grips View Post
    I cannot believe what n read here. Nobody can sort out carbs any more. Really the simplest form of fueling.

    On any of these types of projects, you need to find the base line. That base line is as close to manufacturers spec as possible.
    So don't even try and tune for power or economy, until you have that base line.

    In this case maybe just jetted wrong for the application. A low tech carb too high tech for today's high tech youngsters
    On these carbs you need to start at the bottom.
    Strip it down and make sure all o-rings and rubbers are good. Accelerator diaphragm is the first to perish.
    Clean them properly with Carb Cleaner.
    Make sure the needle and seat seals.
    Set the float levels.
    Make sure that when you reassemble, the carbs loose no vacuum anywhere.
    Roughly set the balance between the 2 carbs.
    Set the static timing to manufacturers spec.
    Fit new plugs. Manufacturers spec.
    Pull all the plug leads so they just est on the plugs.
    Set all mixture screws to about 2,5 turns out. (Make sure needles are not bent.)
    Start car and now you start the black art.
    Make sure your advance curve is as per manufacturers spec.
    Pull each plug wire and listen to the engine. Each plug wire should let the engine miss-fire evenly, when you lift that plug wire. If not, start fiddling the balance screw until it does,
    Now start fiddling the mixture screws, to get the motor as smooth as possible.
    All the you lift the plug wires to make sure you are on the right track.
    Once it starts idling properly, it should rev fairly freely.
    Now take it on the road and test all rev ranges and all acceleration profiles.
    Run it up a hill and make sure it pulls cleanly.
    When it idles, that exhaust should be nice and hot.

    All this is futile if you have the wrong jets, choke tubes or emulsion tubes.

    If you are to scared to strip a carb, don't even try this.

    Grips, what did I skip.
    Last edited by Henris; 2019/09/20 at 07:00 AM.
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  27. #60
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    Default Re: Feroza 7AGE 20V SILVERTOP TOYOTA

    I have offered assistance, waiting for a reply.
    I might be a FOOL, but I am an OLD fool - from unknown.

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