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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by LouisF View Post
    It is not just loans, but also clothing and furniture accounts. One of the first things some new employees in the below R7500 category do is to request a letter of employment in order to open clothing or furniture account.
    Fact is they don't know how to work with their income.

    I have had a couple that suddenly change their banking details. 3 months later the Sherrif arrives with an order against their salaries.

    If something comes up, instead of budgeting, they skip a few payments and the problems start.

    These guys also buy expensive stuff!

    We've tried to give them some training on personal finance management. But it hasn't been very successful.

    Therefore if one looks at Marikana and the alleged reasons behind it, I don't forsee much changing and we can expect more of the same.

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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    How else would they keep the dummies from voting for them when the next opportunity comes around? Oh yeah, that's right, write off their debt.
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Interesting... yet again so if you are poor - EVERYTHING is free.

    Ridiculous but ja that is basically how socialists operate.

    It is however interesting to see which sectors in SA are still indicating good growth despite the downturn of the economy - and financial services are still doing very well. This however is not sustainable in the long term and the big bang is coming.
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Behind it is just a vote catching scheme.
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by LouisF View Post
    It is not just loans, but also clothing and furniture accounts. One of the first things some new employees in the below R7500 category do is to request a letter of employment in order to open clothing or furniture account.
    For a long time the main business for some clothing and furniture stores has not been to sell the product but give loans. Product has been just an excuse for the loan, personal insurance, 5 year warranty on wooden table... Some curbs have been put on this. End result has been Edgon and furniture store "failures". Problem moved to African Bank and I have been worried about Capitec for some time.

    Having too much debt applies to all income groups. You can see the problem in many places. Go to a shop and "sorry we do not stock that item anymore". What people can afford to buy is changing.
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  6. #26
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Why do people loan money, because they need it. Will this stop the need, NO. It will however stop the legal loan guys, and the loan sharks will have a party.

    Remember some small entrepreneurs need a little cash to purchase a couple of welding material, or to buy stock to resell, but now they need to go to the unregulated loan guys.

    Bad thing. Stupid thing. SA further down the drain.
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  8. #27
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by stevan View Post
    Why do people loan money, because they need it. Will this stop the need, NO. It will however stop the legal loan guys, and the loan sharks will have a party.

    Remember some small entrepreneurs need a little cash to purchase a couple of welding material, or to buy stock to resell, but now they need to go to the unregulated loan guys.

    Bad thing. Stupid thing. SA further down the drain.
    Totally agree, most people who's debt will be wiped will be in debt again sooner rather than later. The only outcome of this will be debt will become more expensive.

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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by HannesS View Post
    Totally agree, most people who's debt will be wiped will be in debt again sooner rather than later. The only outcome of this will be debt will become more expensive.
    And unregulated
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by WAJ View Post
    Interesting... yet again so if you are poor - EVERYTHING is free.

    Ridiculous but ja that is basically how socialists operate.

    It is however interesting to see which sectors in SA are still indicating good growth despite the downturn of the economy - and financial services are still doing very well. This however is not sustainable in the long term and the big bang is coming.
    Have you applied your mind, or even read the thread. Nobody is getting anything for free - the life of the poor borrowers is about to get much much worse. How is this socialist or even vote buying?
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Sorry to contradict you but the current flag was not designed by the ANC nor the current government but actually was derived from a design by FG Brownell. It was intended to be an interim flag but because it was so well received at the inauguration of Nelson Mandela it was decided to retain it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Roberto Betta View Post
    Fair point.
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by Gungets Tuft View Post
    Have you applied your mind, or even read the thread. Nobody is getting anything for free - the life of the poor borrowers is about to get much much worse. How is this socialist or even vote buying?
    Totally agree. But perception created in ‘uneducated’ mind will be problematic.
    My concern is the burocracy needed to vet all the applications, rest assured they will come thick and fast.
    So we stop paying when application is in, irrespective if dealt with or ruled upon, with the resultant issues.... down the line.

    In two years hindsight will become an exact science.

    Then the act has section dealing with financial literacy.
    Ja meneer, Nee meneer, jou Moer meneer comes to mind.
    I am being ‘realistic’ here, ‘I didn’t know’ will be used even after fin literacy training.
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  14. #32
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof View Post
    Totally agree. But perception created in ‘uneducated’ mind will be problematic.
    My concern is the burocracy needed to vet all the applications, rest assured they will come thick and fast.
    So we stop paying when application is in, irrespective if dealt with or ruled upon, with the resultant issues.... down the line.

    In two years hindsight will become an exact science.

    Then the act has section dealing with financial literacy.
    Ja meneer, Nee meneer, jou Moer meneer comes to mind.
    I am being ‘realistic’ here, ‘I didn’t know’ will be used even after fin literacy training.
    I don’t think the financially illiterate are going to get to form an opinion. They’ll try to apply for a loan and get declined. The state has made the viability of the loan the lenders responsibility, backed up by the threat that they’ll cancel it if they find it’s an unwise loan. It’s not actually that different from the previous law, that’s actually what protected SA to a large extent in the 2008 crash, the strength of our laws. It’s still abused, and people advised badly, but the previous law had recourse, so I don’t see why we need the new one.

    As an aside, I’ve believed, since the addition of LO to our curriculum, that basic financial literacy should be added. Budgeting, means evaluation, interest rates, far more valuable that half the k#k they teach there.
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  16. #33
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by Plod View Post
    Sorry to contradict you but the current flag was not designed by the ANC nor the current government but actually was derived from a design by FG Brownell. It was intended to be an interim flag but because it was so well received at the inauguration of Nelson Mandela it was decided to retain it.
    Mr Brownell passed away recently, and was mentioned as the designer of the flag on TV.

    He also designed the Namibian flag.

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    Angry Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by AlexP View Post
    The poorest of the poor should not be allowed to take out a loan, as harsh as it seems.
    Earning R7'500 a month is borderline poverty, and even having to pay back (for arguments sake) R150 a month, could have dire consequences for the debtor who has to pay rent, feed probably many mouths, pay an existing funeral policy, transport costs to work and just doesn't have the extra R150 to pay back.

    The banks and registered loan facilitators will adjust accordingly, and sell off their debtors book.
    But the sad truth is that the lower earning income group will be forced to take loans from the "Mashanisa's" and that is where they are trapped in servitude and debt to a gangster.
    Yet if you drive past Diepsloot, each and every shack has a DSTV dish attach to it Jeeezzz that does not look like poverty
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by Spook View Post
    Yet if you drive past Diepsloot, each and every shack has a DSTV dish attach to it Jeeezzz that does not look like poverty
    Those aren’t DSTV but dish based SABC, eTV and a few others. Common misconception.
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    Last edited by Gungets Tuft; 2019/08/19 at 06:49 PM.
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Capitec say that over the last two years they have been reducing the number of loans to people earning less than R7.5k in their loan book. It is now less than 5%.

    So I am a bit sceptical about the banks' claims about the amount they may need to write off. There may be retailers who take a klap, but I would suspect that much of what stands to be written off is non performing debt anyway. If the creditors have not made a provision in their books for this, then they have been lying in their AFS.

    Nothing new, look at Steinhof and then Tongaat also seem to have published dodgy results.

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  21. #37
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by Spook View Post
    Yet if you drive past Diepsloot, each and every shack has a DSTV dish attach to it Jeeezzz that does not look like poverty
    They hack the smart cards, R500 gives you a card valid for 6 months.

    Big business in the townships.

    As for the loans and debts issue: I thought it was a mandated government priority to provide funding to the previously unfundable? Is this law maybe the first step to the new government bank? So then the poor get loans from the state bank and this is all funded by tax money..........and they never have to pay anything back.
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  23. #38
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by Spook View Post
    Yet if you drive past Diepsloot, each and every shack has a DSTV dish attach to it Jeeezzz that does not look like poverty
    You do know most of most of those decoders have been “ fixed” to receive a signal regardless of payment

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  25. #39
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    Quote Originally Posted by Karol View Post
    You do know most of most of those decoders have been “ fixed” to receive a signal regardless of payment
    And you can get SABC for R20 a month on an unfixed dish. Perhaps a source for that “most” number of yours?
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    Default Re: Bad news - no need to pay debts

    I was trying to make a point around R7500 being borderline poverty. Sorry, but I don't agree.

    As for bringing Capitec into this discussion, there too I want to say Bullsh****.

    If you have any account with any bank, as soon as you go online you will find that said bank is offering a personal loan to XXXX amount.

    Now I think that is where our problem lies. Banks inviting people to spend more than what they can afford. I constantly get sms's as well, telling me how a big loan I qualify for.

    Calls, I just tell them I don't have a job. I want the loan, but will not be able to pat it back. Guess what, the line goes dead immediately.
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