Auto vs manual in off road conditions... - Page 2





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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Here's a nice vid by Ronny Dahl comparing auto and manual for off-road

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BE_NMaIL5IQ

    and keep in mind you can't push start an auto

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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Large capacity petrol: auto
    Small capacity petrol or any diesel: manual
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Large capacity petrol: auto
    Small capacity petrol or any diesel: manual

    Very happy with my diesel auto, don't see why I would ever want a manual.
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  5. #24
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    I think my Auto Disco has allowed me to do things I would have battled with if it was a manual. With my inexperienced on the Mountain Passes trip we did a year ago it gave me huge confidence on the more serious passes where low speed traction was the key in wet conditions. Looking at onboa video clips of guys that were with us I realised how easy the auto box in the Disco made it for me. The Td5 isn't the most powerful thing out there but it was amazing with the auto gearbox.
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  6. #25
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Manual is just so much more fun to me at least.

    I vary driving style dependent on mood or situation and a auto just never knows exactly what i want. Some come close of course.

    To me manual pros are:

    - more enjoyable/engaging drive, especially off road and on safari
    - rocking method when stuck
    -engine braking on and off road
    -bump start capability
    -gearbox cheaper to repair if it bombs
    -better fuel economy (more true on older boxes to be fair)
    -teaches you more skill

    Cons:
    -traffic
    -laziness
    -may lose momentum during shifts that isnít ideal in sand or mud
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  8. #26
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by pjf110 View Post

    Cons:
    -traffic
    -laziness
    -may lose momentum during shifts that isnít ideal in sand or mud
    - Burn your clutch
    Some vehicles have the hill descent control that makes life a lot easier. That then would negate some of the issues with hill descend.
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  9. #27
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    And then you are not even talking about being able to drive with a beer or phone in one hand without having to manually change gears!
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  11. #28
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Francois Theron View Post
    Sand driving and especially dune climbing an auto is better,
    A few years ago the Patrol Forum went dune driving.

    In the group were several 4.8 GRX's (5-speed tiptronic auto) but also one of the rare 4.8 GL's, which has a manual gearbox.

    The GL went everywhere the autos went. And this was specifically soft sand and dune work. I guess the driver needs to be ever so slightly more skilled, as he needs to choose the right gear for the obstacle, whereas the auto can change without sacrificing all momentum, but on the really steep dunes it was clear that the guys locking their autos into a set gear where getting further than the guys who were leaving them to do their own thing, so for best results the same driver skill is still required. In the end, in terms of results, there was really no clear winner.

    As for crawling in the rocky stuff, I think some obstacles favor manual (think rock steps on a steep slope, where the auto loses momentum at crucial moments due to the torque converter slipping as the load changes), while others favor auto (think large steps that need to be negotiated as slowly as possible to prevent panel damage).

    Personally I prefer manual, for the reasons Ian mentioned, but also because I actually still ENJOY driving, and to me, smooth gear changes and advanced techniques like heel-and-toe downshifts are among the most enjoyable parts of driving that doesn't get one onto hot water.

    But probably I am much more of a luddite than Ian...
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  13. #29
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Why is bump starting such a big thing that features in the PRO list for manual cars?
    How many guys have in a overland or 4x4 situation actually PUSH started his own car to life from a dead battery?. Also keep in mind that many modern fuel injection vehicles will also not fire up if the battery is under something like 9 volt even if you push it.
    I am not talking towed by another car - because the implication must be that there was not another car available because then you can simply jump start the auto.
    So if you own an auto chuck a set of jump leads in the boot.(which literally all my auto cars have permanently - not just the 4x4 ones)
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  14. #30
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan van Tonder View Post
    Why is bump starting such a big thing that features in the PRO list for manual cars?
    How many guys have in a overland or 4x4 situation actually PUSH started his own car to life from a dead battery?. Also keep in mind that many modern fuel injection vehicles will also not fire up if the battery is under something like 9 volt even if you push it.
    I am not talking towed by another car - because the implication must be that there was not another car available because then you can simply jump start the auto.
    So if you own an auto chuck a set of jump leads in the boot.(which literally all my auto cars have permanently - not just the 4x4 ones)
    Some modern cars can't even be jump-started anymore, or at least, you run a high risk of frying the ECU if you do.

    I have. Not pushed it by hand so much as, once I know I have a suspect battery or alternator, I simply ensure that I park on a slope...
    But mine is not a modern car that won't start at under 9 volts. It is specifically chosen as such...
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  15. #31
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan van Tonder View Post
    Why is bump starting such a big thing that features in the PRO list for manual cars?
    How many guys have in a overland or 4x4 situation actually PUSH started his own car to life from a dead battery?. Also keep in mind that many modern fuel injection vehicles will also not fire up if the battery is under something like 9 volt even if you push it.
    I am not talking towed by another car - because the implication must be that there was not another car available because then you can simply jump start the auto.
    So if you own an auto chuck a set of jump leads in the boot.(which literally all my auto cars have permanently - not just the 4x4 ones)
    I travel with jumpers in the manual too.

    Jumpers mean nothing where there is absolutely no way to get the vehicle started in the middle of the bundus - unless you travel with a spare starter, or starter service kit as well.

  16. #32
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Connan View Post
    ...
    But probably I am much more of a luddite than Ian...
    ...
    That might not be true...

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  18. #33
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    I prefer automatic transmission in 4x4.

    As for the battery issue ..... if you have a dual battery system ....if one battery fails use the other.

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  19. #34
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    I have not seen or have had to fix a failed starter in probably 20 years. It has to be almost one of the most reliable pieces of kit out there these days. But ok - yes if failed starter is the issue - Yes there is one clear advantage. I'll concede to that one.
    Last edited by Stephan van Tonder; 2019/05/15 at 11:53 AM.
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  20. #35
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Well, I have had a manual Pajero and now have an auto and I can tell you this.

    I still can't drive for $!## off road.
    Lusted for a Landy but the Pajero was sexier and bigger in the right departments, just like my Missus.

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  22. #36
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan van Tonder View Post
    I have not seen or have had to fix a failed starter in probably 20 years. It has to be almost one of the most reliable pieces of kit out there these days. But ok - yes if failed starter is the issue - Yes there is one clear advantage.
    I have. On our aborted trip to Bots (in the manual 4.5), the started failed dismally. Originally, we were unsure as to whether it was some other electrical issue. Upon getting the vehicle back to ZA (I drove - with nothing working apart from most basic engine management stuff, injectors and pumps), I inspected everything. It turned out to be poor recon work by the previous owner - the starter's armature had been greased, and over years, this had turned into a nice conductive paste inside the starter. Resulting in all sorts of horrible electrical issues (think dead short when the solenoid kicks in).

    Are starters reliable ? Probably not so much. I recently serviced the auto 4.8's starter whilst waiting for a new one. Fitted the new starter once it arrived, as the original one was on it's way out.

    In short: if you take an auto somewhere remote, make sure you either have a spare starter, or spare solenoid and brushes. And know how to remove, strip and service the starter. Jump starting is not always an option. You might want to take one for a manual too. Push starting a heavily loaded Patrol is not fun.

  23. #37
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Well you are screwed in a v10 touareg. Even if you take a spare you can't change it in the bush. It's an engine out job.
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  25. #38
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    a few years ago manual, today, only one choice auto.
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  27. #39
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Owned 4x4's for some time, and basically need to use 4x4 about every weekend. I have learned to use low range lately, in both the V6 cruiser (manual) and Prado (auto diesel). Both dont have not enough torque in high range at low revs in tricky situations.

    The V6 just stalls if not enough revs, the problem however with the auto is that it dont stalls, it just dont move, then you need to give more fuel and then at one stage its too much.
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    Default Re: Auto vs manual in off road conditions...

    Quote Originally Posted by JLK View Post
    the problem however with the auto is that it dont stalls, it just dont move, then you need to give more fuel and then at one stage its too much.
    That is exactly what I meant with manual being better in slow rock crawling
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