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  1. #21
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Dold View Post
    I find -5C is as low as I need to go.
    Used to go to -10 before doing some tests.
    You are probably right Paul...though often Im having to freeze some fish! But for traveling overland and simply keeping frozen perishables like meat etc from going off -5 is no doubt ample.
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

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  2. #22
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    A slight change of topic...if I did decide to go to those Discover AGMs Im guessing I need to upgrade my alternator which is the stock standard old Toyota 80 Series alt. I dont think it pushes out more than 13.8v.

    Any idea of who in the Nelspruit area could do that for me...or should I be looking for a DC-DC charger. Or both?
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  3. #23
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    With fish I am always very careful!
    -15C!

    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB View Post
    You are probably right Paul...though often Im having to freeze some fish! But for traveling overland and simply keeping frozen perishables like meat etc from going off -5 is no doubt ample.

    Africa changes you forever, like nowhere on earth. Once you have been there, you will never be the same." - Ernest Hemingway

  4. #24
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB View Post
    Does anybody have any user experience with those Discover EV Traction Dry Cell Deep Cycle batteries?
    I bought my Discover EV27A (100AH) in January 2014 from Bush Power for R2500. It is fitted in the engine bay of the Colt. Charging was with a solenoid system until I fitted the WRND DC-DC charger in January 2018. I run a National Luna Weekender normally set at 5C, -5C in freezer compartment, and a couple of LED lights. From March 2017 I have added 2 80W solar panels. So far I have had no problems with the battery.
    Pete

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  6. #25
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Dold View Post
    With fish I am always very careful!
    -15C!
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  7. #26
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Thanks for that. Looks like a Discover & a DC-DC is in my imminent future!

    Quote Originally Posted by petewill View Post
    I bought my Discover EV27A (100AH) in January 2014 from Bush Power for R2500. It is fitted in the engine bay of the Colt. Charging was with a solenoid system until I fitted the WRND DC-DC charger in January 2018. I run a National Luna Weekender normally set at 5C, -5C in freezer compartment, and a couple of LED lights. From March 2017 I have added 2 80W solar panels. So far I have had no problems with the battery.
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  8. #27
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB View Post
    A slight change of topic...if I did decide to go to those Discover AGMs Im guessing I need to upgrade my alternator which is the stock standard old Toyota 80 Series alt. I dont think it pushes out more than 13.8v.

    Any idea of who in the Nelspruit area could do that for me...or should I be looking for a DC-DC charger. Or both?
    If your starter battery is full and no other high amp loads, that alternator is merely a "constant voltage power supply" at 14.2V. (Not at idle but above 1500 RPM for sure...)

    If it only gives 13.8V (which I doubt) then your starter battery would ave given your the moans and groans already. Any Auto Electrician can test it properly. (Stay away from Midas/Autozone etc - go to a real Auto Electr)

    Connecting another battery (AGM or not) directly will work, but has a number of potential issues....

    Connecting via a proper solenoid system is better

    But a DC-DC charger is the best.
    2000 Patrol GU 4.2D(onkey) "old-timer" and wise at 848 000 km
    2014 Patrol GU 3.0CRD "teenager" in puberty at 105 000 km
    2007 Echo3 Trailer "the nest" Braked Axle fitted at +50 000 km
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  9. #28
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Thanks Dung...

    Interestingly my alternator is only putting out 13.46 - 13.5v but Im not having any issues with my starter battery at all (and Ive just completed a long trip to Moz where the vehicle stood unused for a week at a time.

    But Im taking it to Bosch for new brushes etc, and will fit a Ctek 250sa or NL DC-DC charger after that. Possibly with a SmartPass too.
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  10. #29
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB View Post
    Thanks Dung...

    Interestingly my alternator is only putting out 13.46 - 13.5v but I’m not having any issues with my starter battery at all (and I’ve just completed a long trip to Moz where the vehicle stood unused for a week at a time.

    But I’m taking it to Bosch for new brushes etc, and will fit a Ctek 250sa or NL DC-DC charger after that. Possibly with a SmartPass too.

    These are more bang for the buck than the Ctek or NL

    https://4x4direct.co.za/dc-to-dc-cha...trol-hcdp.html

    Note the HcdP 20A is actually a 30A machine if you take the bypass in count (possible similar in function than Smartpass?) - it can also handle 400W of panels

    https://4x4direct.co.za/dc-to-dc-cha...olar-mppt.html
    Last edited by Dungbeetle; 2019/05/05 at 09:14 AM.
    2000 Patrol GU 4.2D(onkey) "old-timer" and wise at 848 000 km
    2014 Patrol GU 3.0CRD "teenager" in puberty at 105 000 km
    2007 Echo3 Trailer "the nest" Braked Axle fitted at +50 000 km
    2012 NP300 YD2.5 D/C 2x4 High Rider "platkar" at 120 000 km

  11. #30
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Well I bit the bullet this morning and picked up the Discover 100ah AGM battery (model EV27A-A) and the NL auxiliary battery box (not the one with built-in solenoid etc, the one with pre-wired plugs & switches). Still not decided on which DC-DC charger to go for, I get lots of differing opinions. The HcdP mentioned above is best priced but only 20A for R2050. NL 25A DC-DC is about R5,500. The CTEK 250SA which seems to be the one by which all others are judged (am I correct?) is also R5500 but an extra R1k for the temperature sensor, so R6500. Im told (by a salesman at 4x4 MW that the CTEK is faster! (?)

    I was also recommended to add a CTEK SmartPass (around R3k?) which would result in a potential 140A charge input. Would this be good for the battery?

    Standing by...

    (BTW I also have 2 x 100A 12v panels for use when stationary in camp.)
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  12. #31
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    As mentioned earlier the DCDC20A-WRND charger seems the best bang for ur bucks. I notice it is not on ur short list. You can then use it for ur solar panels as well provided the panels don't have a voltage over 40V instead of the 75/15 Victron.

    I would rather add the DCDC20A-WRND than to have the alternator voltage increased just for the new batteries.

  13. #32
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    Default AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Sorry Ekkekan...I thought the HcdP was the same one as the WRND.

    Is this the one you mean - great price if it is!

    https://4x4direct.co.za/dc-to-dc-cha...olar-mppt.html

    Thanks for your input.
    Last edited by DarylB; 2019/05/05 at 07:15 PM.
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  14. #33
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB View Post
    Sorry Ekkekan...I thought the HcdP was the same one as the WRND.

    Is this the one you mean - great price if it is!

    https://4x4direct.co.za/dc-to-dc-cha...olar-mppt.html

    Thanks for your input.
    That's the one I use to charge my Discover battery.
    Pete

    ADVENTURE BEFORE DEMENTIA

    2002 Mitsubishi Colt Rodeo 3.0

  15. #34
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB View Post
    Sorry Ekkekan...I thought the HcdP was the same one as the WRND.

    Is this the one you mean - great price if it is!

    https://4x4direct.co.za/dc-to-dc-cha...olar-mppt.html

    Thanks for your input.
    Yes that is a very popular DC-DC as well as solar input controller. It was mentioned by Dungbeetle.

  16. #35
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Interested to hear comments from real world users out there. I sent my queries to NL and got a very comprehensive response, including: But :
    - If alternator voltage is good (>13.8V) then you will likely get better performance from a standard solenoid-based system. Spend your money on good batteries.
    - If your driving time is short (2-3 hours) then you will likely benefit more from a standard system.
    - If you already use solar or other charge sources most of the time, you probably won't benefit much from a DC-DC system.
    - DC-DC systems have limited current capability so charge rate can be low.

    So now Im dazed & confused, trying to decide how to rearrange my auxiliary battery systems!

    I have a 2-3 year old Royal calcium battery (in fact two of them) of which one is in a NL power box complete with NL solenoid and a Victron 75/15 MPPT with 2x100 12v batteries.

    Then I bought last weekend a Discover 100ah AGM along with a NL auxiliary power box (no charger) thinking Id add a DC-DC to this and switch the solar panels to charge this battery.

    Now Im wondering if I should put the AGM into the NL power box, charge it via the solenoid and the Victron, and add a DC-DC to the NL auxiliary box with the Royal in that.

    I have a PSA008 Smart Charger plus a NL 0,8/5A intelli charger to top up batteries whenever I have access to mains.

    Does this sound about right?

    (BTW after charging the Discover AGM overnight on the intelli charger it showed full and 14,5/6 volts. After disconnecting the charger this stabilized at 13.1 or 13.2v. My Royal after a full charge shows 12.8 or 12.9 v. Is this correct?

    Thanks in advance.
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  17. #36
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

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  19. #37
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by DarylB View Post

    Does this sound about right?

    (BTW after charging the Discover AGM overnight on the intelli charger it showed full and 14,5/6 volts. After disconnecting the charger this stabilized at 13.1 or 13.2v. My Royal after a full charge shows 12.8 or 12.9 v. Is this correct?

    Thanks in advance.
    These voltages do like right to me after being charged.
    Yes the solenoid system will always charge faster. The last 10% of the charge does indeed takes ages. The high current of the solenoid get the battery to 80% real quick and then I would say the panels/220V can take over when at a destination. Nothing wrong in charging each extra battery on different systems as indicated. It all depends on how long you are travelling. Always start with full batteries from home base.

    Due to AGM charging faster I agree using it on the NL box and charge via solenoid and expect it to be fuller than the Royal that is on the DC to DC.

    I am just giving my opinion and some guys will have the actual experience on the equipment you need answers to.

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  21. #38
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Be sure you are aware of the charging for the last 10% on the AGM

    https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/..._glass_mat_agm


    As with all gelled and sealed units, AGM batteries are sensitive to overcharging. A charge to 2.40V/cell (and higher) is fine; however, the float charge should be reduced to between 2.25 and 2.30V/cell (summer temperatures may require lower voltages). Automotive charging systems for flooded lead acid often have a fixed float voltage setting of 14.40V (2.40V/cell); a direct replacement with a sealed unit could overcharge the battery on a long drive.
    1998 Daihatsu Rocky 'The Kitty'
    2002 Daihatsu Rocky 'The Bully'

    "Socialism only works in two places: Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they already have it." -Ronald Reagan.

  22. #39
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof View Post
    Be sure you are aware of the charging for the last 10% on the AGM

    https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/..._glass_mat_agm
    Thanks Prof, some interesting views in the Comments section of that battery university.

    Especially about AGM batteries not lasting at high ambient temperatures. Which does not bode well for southern African conditions.
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

  23. #40
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    Default Re: AGM Battery Recharge Time

    Quote Originally Posted by Prof View Post
    Thanks Prof...is missed that thread. Though it seems there are as many opinions as there are battery choices. And like with batteries, not all ideal.
    If you want to go into the bush, take a Ford. If you want to get back, take a Landcruiser!

    Series 80 'Cruiser GX Diesel 1996
    Cooper ST Maxx 265/75/16 tyres;
    ARB bullbar; 9000kg T-Max winch; Outback roofrack; Double fuel tank; Outback Extreme spare wheel carrier x 2; Air Spring boosters; Racor diesel filter; NL dual battery set-up; 2 x 100w solar panels; Big Country gullwings, Front Runner drawer system; Stofpad 4x4 drop-down fridge slide; NL 78-litre double door fridge/freezer; NL 60-litre freezer; Eeziawn rooftop tent; Eeziawn awning.

    SWAMBO: Honda CRV 2.2 Diesel

    Previously: '98 Defender 110 HT TDi, Landy SIII S/W, Hilux D/C 4x4,
    Isuzu 2,3 4x4, Isuzu 2,0 4x4, Isuzu 1600 4x4, Chev Nomad, Cheetah beach buggy!

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