Is this it? - Page 164





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Thread: Is this it?

  1. #3261
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by byaru1 View Post
    For 1.5m ... I rather stick with the proper hardcore brutes that are loaded with kit.

    Give me the Prado 4.0 VXL or LC200 VXR.
    I also like ox wagons , but prefer them as ornaments in the garden
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  3. #3262
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    I guess the new Grenadier will settle the argument , and I will take a bet sales will be slow in SA , unless they are dirt cheap
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by cor View Post
    I guess the new Grenadier will settle the argument , and I will take a bet sales will be slow in SA , unless they are dirt cheap
    Settle what argument?
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fontuin View Post
    Settle what argument?
    If the new Defender should have been the old one
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Now if that Grenadier can be bought with a choice of engines, I would even be interested.

    Would like to go with a 1KD Toyota. 3.0 D4D
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  9. #3266
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by cor View Post
    If the new Defender should have been the old one
    Not sure what argument needs to be settled or what the Grenadier has to do with it?

    If you're after a complex luxurious family bus and you have money to burn, then the New Defender should be the New one.

    If you're after a simple workhorse, as the old one was, then the New Defender should have been an upgraded version of the old one.
    Last edited by Fontuin; 2020/07/07 at 08:36 AM.
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henris View Post
    Now if that Grenadier can be bought with a choice of engines, I would even be interested.

    Would like to go with a 1KD Toyota. 3.0 D4D
    Yes. Or something like Isuzu 4J range of motors.
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fontuin View Post
    Not sure what argument needs to be settled or what the Grenadier has to do with it?

    If you're after a complex luxurious family bus and you have money to burn, then the New Defender should be the New one.

    If you're after a simple workhorse, as the old one was, then the New Defender should have been an upgraded version of the old one.
    Exactly , but which of the 2 . Sales will tell . If LR outsell the Grenadier they will be proven right , if not “ eina “ . My money is on the New Defender. There’s been an ongoing argument that LR should have just upgraded the old Defender
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hedgehog View Post
    I have to state that this thing has turned out to be stupidly expensive... Really just sad. Landrover and Jeep, must have the same market annalists.
    Problem is compared to what? When a LC and Patrol is over 1.5 bar.

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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Saw one yesterday and was a little underwhelmed, it looks better in the pictures than in the flesh to me. Wasn’t able to have a look inside as it was on a raised stand.

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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by oradba69 View Post
    Problem is compared to what? When a LC and Patrol is over 1.5 bar.
    So.. comparing it to 2 V8s, with all options added...
    Last edited by Hedgehog; 2020/07/07 at 09:21 AM.
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  16. #3272
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by cor View Post
    Exactly , but which of the 2 . Sales will tell . If LR outsell the Grenadier they will be proven right , if not “ eina “ . My money is on the New Defender. There’s been an ongoing argument that LR should have just upgraded the old Defender
    I don't expect Grenadier to outsell the New Defender, but the Grenadier is what many old Defender owners want and it's what the Old Defender was, it's the Old Defender, upgraded.

    The school run market is larger than the workhorse market.

    You are correct though, it would be a serious embarrassment if the Grenadier does outsell the New Defender.

    My opinion is that the New Defender is going to scavenge sales off of their other models more than anything else, and they've lost some of their Defender customers.

    On the threads on this forum, the few people who I have come across who have shown an interest in the New Defender are trading their Evogues, Discovery 5s, Discovery Sports in.. I doubt that very many people will be moving from another brand for it.
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Daar is niks so goed soos kompetisie nie!

    I am convinced that within 18 mths(albeit covid 19 time frame)JRL will bring out the commercial versions, much much cheaper entry level models , Hardtops we now know will be there , but I really think a pick up will complete the range, especially in lwb versions like 130.
    They will undercut the Grenadier by a big margin.
    I also predict the new Defender will be a popular vehicle in the USA,
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    It is such a pity the old 4xForum data is gone, it would be really interesting to compare this discussion to the discussions when the D3 was announced and launched, mall crawler, useless, would never see the bush, sandton4x4 etc.

    Humans hate progress and change

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    Default Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirk View Post
    It is such a pity the old 4xForum data is gone, it would be really interesting to compare this discussion to the discussions when the D3 was announced and launched, mall crawler, useless, would never see the bush, sandton4x4 etc.

    Humans hate progress and change
    I don't hate it, I love it, but I cannot bring myself to accept the price.
    And here is the crux of the matter; they could have made it even more expensive. .. And it will still sell well.


    What pains me, is the fact that they (JLR) have spent so much time and energy into creating a truly wonderful, capable overlander, only to then turn it into a fashionable item, a gimmick that will be consumed by the inner city dwellers, the hipsters, so that they can boast about it at braais, BBQ's and cookouts. They wanted a new Defender but created a fashion accessory.
    Last edited by Hedgehog; 2020/07/07 at 10:24 AM.
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  21. #3276
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirk View Post
    It is such a pity the old 4xForum data is gone, it would be really interesting to compare this discussion to the discussions when the D3 was announced and launched, mall crawler, useless, would never see the bush, sandton4x4 etc.

    Humans hate progress and change
    D3 and D4 hasn't exactly covered itself in glory.

    Didn't you own a D3, and now you drive an archaic solid axle ox-wagon?

    I was also a fan of the D3, until we owned one, I was very quickly cured of Land Rover after that, no new Land Rover ever again. And to top it all off, it was pretty average off-road and not suited to it all.

    Those who warned me against buying it in those days were correct.

    Many have the same story.

    The reality is that Land Rover has an incredibly poor reputation for dependability and it's because they only build unnecessarily complex, expensive vehicles.

    There is no reason to believe that this new reiteration of the D4 will be any different.
    Last edited by Fontuin; 2020/07/07 at 09:59 AM.
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  23. #3277
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fontuin View Post
    D3 and D4 hasn't exactly covered itself in glory.

    Didn't you own a D3, and now you drive an archaic solid axle ox-wagon?

    I was also a fan of the D3, until we owned one, I was very quickly cured of Land Rover after that, no new Land Rover ever again. And to top it all off, it was pretty average off-road and not suited to it all.

    Those who warned me against buying it in those days were correct.

    Many have the same story.

    The reality is that Land Rover has an incredibly poor reputation for dependability and it's because they only build unnecessarily complex, expensive vehicles.

    There is no reason to believe that this new reiteration of the D4 will be any different.
    Well said.

  24. #3278
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hedgehog View Post
    I don't hate it, I love it, but I cannot bring myself to accept the price.
    And here is the crux of the matter; they could have made it even more expensive. .. And it will still sell well.


    What pains me, is the fact that they (JLR) have spent so much time and energy into creating a truly wonderful, capable overlander, only to then turn it into a fashionable item, a gimmick that will be consumed by the inner city dwellers, the hipsters, so that they can boast about it at braais, BBQ's and cookouts. They wanted a new Defender but created a fashion accessory.
    Shew - so much stereotyping in one statement! I have bought one and I don't classify myself as any of the people you are describing above.

    I am in the bush at least once a month and undertake at least one overlanding trip per year. I sold my fully kitted 2015 Puma to in order to buy this one and it was not an easy decision for me. I loved my Puma but it was an irrational love. The Puma was slow and noisy, the driving position uncomfortable for front passengers and terrible for rear passengers. If you sat in the back and tried to look out the window for game you would be staring straight into the panel between the door window and the alpine window. No matter how much I tried to prevent it, the Puma would suck in dust like an electrolux and it became a daily routine to wipe down the interior while on a trip. Still I loved it

    But ultimately rationality won out. I will be able to use my new Defender as daily driver while at the same time it will be fully capable of doing what I need it to do on all the overlanding trips I plan to use it for and it will be a LOT more comfortable!

    Long story short maybe you should stick to debating the merits of the vehicle based purely on what it is and not on what you assume the people motivations are for buying it are.
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  26. #3279
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    Default Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulMark View Post
    Shew - so much stereotyping in one statement!

    Long story short maybe you should stick to debating the merits of the vehicle based purely on what it is and not on what you assume the people motivations are for buying it are.
    I applaud your resolve and there will be many like you, but you will be the minority.

    Unfortunately the marketing strategy of Land Rover, the press photos and the pre launch add campaign speak for itself, also the fact that they have added all this content, or fad to it, has made it more expensive than what it could have been.. And this "content" or gimmicks that were added, was to attract the hipsters.

    My comment stands and will be proven correct.
    The price, the accessories and the trim levels will prove me right.
    And those low profile tyres....

    PS: I love the way your post was liked by someone who drives the biggest fashion accessory out there...
    Last edited by Hedgehog; 2020/07/07 at 11:19 AM.
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  27. #3280
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    Default Re: Is this it?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hedgehog View Post
    ....PS: I love the way your post was liked by someone who drives the biggest fashion accessory out there...
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