Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!! - Page 2





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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by BruceB View Post
    Welding in a high stress fatigue point... That's a structural boo-boo right there.

    Putting a hole in the tension flange of the draw bar at the point of maximum bending moment is however spectacularly stupid detailing.
    You disagree and agree with me in one post!

    It is standard practice to reinforce chassis rails at "weak" or "weakened" points by welding in flanges / webs / box sections, so what did I say wrong?
    I can understand the convenience of the hole in the bottom flange (to get access to the top flange), but then the solution would be to reinforce / strengthen the bottom flange by appropriate means, would it not?
    "Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity" - Martin Luther king Jr

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  2. #22
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Yes, these are Rentals, I did state that from the start, yes they do more miles than the average Joe's van.

    Does that mean that they are only built for limited off-road use? or limited use in general?
    Land Rover is not a vehicle it is a cult!
    Gas Gas 300 with training wheels.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant1 View Post
    Have you taken this up with a dealer or Conqueror HQ.


    I am on my 3rd Conqueror and start the relationship in 1999 yes I have had a few issues that needed attention and all were resold amicably. As for the "time bomb" what a lot of nonsense. What often happens is additions to the caravan and abuse, drastically reduce the structure and reliability.

    Entertaining comments from BL owners, thanks for your opinion.

    Best suggestion is to get the caravan to Heidelberg HQ and discuss options with team. To expect a no charge repair is ludicrous, as this is not a new van. What model is it,what mileage has it done and has it been serviced regularly ?
    All correspondence has been with Heidelberg.
    This is not a servicable part as in brakes etc but the A-frame, as in part of the chassis.
    It not being a new van is not the point, the frame broke.
    At a clear weak point.
    All damage was caused by the frame breaking.

    This is not the only one, this is a known issue.
    Last edited by Congo; 2017/05/22 at 02:42 PM.
    Land Rover is not a vehicle it is a cult!
    Gas Gas 300 with training wheels.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter1949 View Post
    In my opinion the insurance company has the right to repudiate the claim for the damage / repairs / compensation but should take up the costs of action against the manufacturer if that is where the problem lies.

    COMPREHENSIVE insurance cover surely means just that!?


    The insured party should be placed in a similar position had the incident not have occurred.
    The insured party was (according to info. provided here) NOT responsible for the failure and therefore should be covered.

    Of course I am assuming that he did have comprehensive cover including off-road (4x4) cover in place.

    Peter

    All insurance policies cover 'defined events'. Comprehensive cover does not cover vehicle maintenance issues so why should they ever entertain defective design or workmanship. That being said most commercial insurance has cover for this scenario just depends on the manufacturer's policy.

    As stated in previous posts they are 'morally liable' but contractually not really. This might not go down very well but the fact this is a rental trailer is somewhat problematic

    Best approach is diplomatic cap-in-hand approach threats of litigation will be counter productive.

    My 2cw.

    Roy


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  5. #25
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    I am not convinced that it is a "known issue" ..... I for one have not heard of it and seemingly Google and the likes including this forum is also oblivious to this "known issue"


    if it is a "known Issue" as claimed by you, then surely you would have attended to this yourself by strengthening the A frame when this "known issue" was 1t brought to your attention?

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by divvie View Post
    I am not convinced that it is a "known issue" ..... I for one have not heard of it and seemingly Google and the likes including this forum is also oblivious to this "known issue"


    if it is a "known Issue" as claimed by you, then surely you would have attended to this yourself by strengthening the A frame when this "known issue" was 1t brought to your attention?
    I too was not aware of the issue, until we had the failure, you are perfectly correct, if I had known about it I would have fixed it before hand.

    But when I started asking around....
    As per the head of the workshop in Heidelberg.

    Now you have been warned, inspect the holes on the A-frame often for cracking and have it fixed before it breaks off!
    Land Rover is not a vehicle it is a cult!
    Gas Gas 300 with training wheels.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    ok ..... to be clear .... so it is not a "known issue"? in fact it is more probable that the unit was abused and overloaded whereby the weakest area (please read ..not weak area) gave in?

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by divvie View Post
    ok ..... to be clear .... so it is not a "known issue"? in fact it is more probable that the unit was abused and overloaded whereby the weakest area (please read ..not weak area) gave in?
    To be clear, yes, Conqueror was very aware of the issue. (They did try to address it on the new one by using thicker material)
    That they have had failures from non rental units, yes, they did.

    When I phoned Heidelberg just after getting the call from Botswana to find out if they might have a spare a-frame in stock, the parts sales persons words were..."aaa no not another one"

    That this is a weak point that will most likely fail, well, read the report from the independent inspection.

    Go have a look under your van, find the hole on the a-frame, right below the cross beam that carries the body, now look for cracks, tell me again that you are not concerned.
    Land Rover is not a vehicle it is a cult!
    Gas Gas 300 with training wheels.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    no I am not .... I have a new one with presumably the thicker steel ... sold my old one which lasted for 5 years without issues referred to by you.

    Again, the issues referred to by ou are not known on the internet or this forum...

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by divvie View Post
    no I am not .... I have a new one with presumably the thicker steel ... sold my old one which lasted for 5 years without issues referred to by you.

    Again, the issues referred to by ou are not known on the internet or this forum...
    Divvie, I think it has a lot to do with use and the type of trips are done. Sondela type trips etc. don't stress vans in any way.

    I think the more 'Africa' trips you do and if the van( any brand before the sensitive souls get upset) has an inherent weakness or design flaw then it will be more likely to manifest itself in a serious manner.
    2016 LC 200 VX, 2014 D4 SDV6 HSE(sold),2015 Suzuki Jimny, 2019 VW Tiguan 4mtion 2.0tsi(work vehicle), "A little Red Car", Swambo 2013 A3 Sportback Quattro, Bush Lapa Baobab 1873, Fusion 17 boat-Yamaha FT100hp 4st.

  11. #31
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Bruce,
    I totally agree ...... my Companion gets used for why I bought it, i.e. going to Botwana like now in June for three weeks, hence not a road caravan .... my previous companion lasted 5 years going to remote places. the important part is that you have to look after it .....service wise and not to overload and abuse it .....

    we are all acutely aware that cases are reported where even cruisers had issues with chassis where they were overloaded and abused .....

    fact is ... the OP cant with certainty say that the unit was not abused .....in fact we all know that rentals take a much harder beading than your own ....

  12. #32
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    I have now been informed by a very upset Conqueror head office that they in fact have not increased the material thickness and that I was told this in error.

    Apparently there is an Australian spec "skid plate" that I was advised would increase the A-Frame durability.

    Further I was informed that Conqueror will not take any responsibility on any failures of any sort on units used for rentals.
    Land Rover is not a vehicle it is a cult!
    Gas Gas 300 with training wheels.

  13. #33
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    This is a difficult one, the van definitely sees a lot more use, and possibly abuse being a rental unit. One do not know what kind of terrain and speeds it's been subjected too in the past.

    Edit, if it was a design fault surely you would see this problem all over?
    Last edited by Dirk; 2017/05/22 at 05:29 PM.

  14. #34
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Dirk View Post

    Edit, if it was a design fault surely you would see this problem all over?
    Not something that Conqueror would advertise.

    Not all Conqueror users are on the Forum.
    Last edited by Prof; 2017/05/22 at 05:48 PM. Reason: Spelling
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  15. #35
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    The most important part is that it is something that is now sticking its head out.

    Ford kuga owners were also blissfully unaware of the fact that their pride an joy could go up in flames any minute. Eventually it turned into a major recall.

    The Point of posts like this on the forum is use it don't use it type info.
    Now in 6 months time, if someone should encounter a similar situation then at least a google search will bring up results.

    Remeber, the fact that it's not on the internet yet does not mean it is not true.

    How many trailer recoveries from Botswana and Zambia has been posted on the forum in the recent past?? How many of those recoveries were as a result of A-frame failures??
    Time to ask questions or not yet?

    my 2c's
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  16. #36
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by 4eTouareg View Post
    You disagree and agree with me in one post!

    It is standard practice to reinforce chassis rails at "weak" or "weakened" points by welding in flanges / webs / box sections, so what did I say wrong?
    I can understand the convenience of the hole in the bottom flange (to get access to the top flange), but then the solution would be to reinforce / strengthen the bottom flange by appropriate means, would it not?
    All I was stating is that "quick" fixes rarely work with fatigue.

    She's a devious b. Welding on the tension flange is definitely not standard practice when she is around. So from my point of view, reinforcing the tension flange by welding needs very careful consideration, because you could easily/ most likely make the situation worse.

    How many companies like Conqueror have the skillset to understand this? Most of them rely on their customers to endurance test their products. There is an obvious weakness in their design, but this is common with all trailers. I often cringe at the detailing I see on them. Things I wouldn't consider doing on heavy equipment are common place. This is across the board. Every big name brand. This unit will have seen more work and being a rental probably more abuse than your typical unit. All products are designed to a quality/cost balance. Push it too hard and it will break. Your typical bakkie only makes about 30k km of endurance testing. If you use it like this you will be disappointed, but the other 99% of people will be very happy. Let's take the example on this thread who used his companion for five years to Botswana. So what's that 5 long off-road trips? A rental probably does that in three months. How old is the van in question? A year? So maybe it's done 15 to 20 years of regular use?

    So after 15min thought, personally, my solution is to get the hole out the tension flange. A crush tube through the box on the neutral axis and an angle iron bracket on the box would probably do it for about R250 worth of labour and materials. Added to this a soft toe on the box that's bolted on would be a good idea.

  17. #37
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Looking at this units rental history, we have been renting it out for about a year and a half, it has been to Botswana 6 times, Mozambuiqe twice.
    Mostly how ever it does short weekend trips with people intending to buy a Companion for themselves.

    In that sense we actually sell a lot of caravans on behalf of people like Conqueror and yet Conqueror themselves will not support us.
    Funny that.
    Land Rover is not a vehicle it is a cult!
    Gas Gas 300 with training wheels.

  18. #38
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Quote Originally Posted by BruceB View Post
    All I was stating is that "quick" fixes rarely work with fatigue.


    So after 15min thought, personally, my solution is to get the hole out the tension flange. A crush tube through the box on the neutral axis and an angle iron bracket on the box would probably do it for about R250 worth of labour and materials. Added to this a soft toe on the box that's bolted on would be a good idea.
    Bruce I had the same plan and asked the staff at Conqueror if they would allow me to do this on a new A-frame before sending it off to the galvanizers but as per usual I had zero response from them.

    I will now do it myself.
    Land Rover is not a vehicle it is a cult!
    Gas Gas 300 with training wheels.

  19. #39
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    Morning all. Just want to know if the commander also have some unknown flaws. Bought a 2nd hand one in February and not sure what to look for.

  20. #40
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    Default Re: Conqueror Companion A-Frame Failure!!

    In support of Congo, my one Companion broke an A-frame last year in Moremi. Inspection of other my Companions revealed another with cracking around the same area where the problem exists. I didn't take this up with Conqueror HQ but in my dealings with them and ordering parts I got the idea that this has happened before.
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