WK Grand Cherokee VS KK Cherokee

[Forest Fab]

It's more a matter of finding who can recondition them than if they can be reconditioned.

[Rainier Vermaak]

The only place I found that recon Bosch injectors is Diesel Technic in Biberach, Germany. Nobody local.

[Forest Fab]

I had the ones on my 2.5 CRD KJ done by someone in the Durban area. Not sure who as I went through a diesel mech connection here in PMB.
R4k for two injectors. That's 3/4th of a new one from Jeep

[Nox]

Got a WK 3.0 CRD and had a KJ 3.7
THe KJ was a cool vehicle, then when looking for a Jeep again earlier last year went to look at KK's and WK's as well as the XK (Commander)
The KK can be done up real nice and looks great. Also the 3.7 on that body has got quite a bit of go. The KJ gearbox was crappy though imho. The KK has the same one.
After sitting in the WK's and XK's the KK interior felt cheap and quite a lot smaller.
After driving the 3.0CRD and 4.7/5.7 V8's they felt under-powered

You get a lot more "vehicle-for-money" with the WK/XK's but yeah maybe a bit more money if crap goes wrong.

I've also heard injector horror stories at first....then saw that places like ANG / UAP etc can fit them for...although stil expensive, for much less.
I have ALSO heard but not sure how valid it is that you can go to Bosch directly and get them or go to Merc Indies who can get you new ones or ones that came from accident damaged vehicles.

So at least there are options since the Engine and Gearbox is straight out of he Mercs. Lots of German and Merc indies around.
I loved my Defender for what it was. The WK is none of that. The WK has really grown on me though...so much so that I'll almost say it's the best vehicle I've owned so far. Swambo also loves to drive it. Very practical as well, low on fuel for such a vehicle, powerful, spacious, looks good, all the creature comforts, can do offroad pretty damn well, and can cruise in town or on the highway no issues without breaking the bank in fuel bills and having to stop every 250km's to fill up every trip you take. Very few of them get modified so If you lift it add some tyres you have something a little more unique looking than the average 4x4 I guess if that floats your boat.

Not sure how the 3.7 is in the WK but thats also an option. Very reliable engine. I wanted to try one but it was out of town and I wanted Command Trac 2 - that was non negotiable. I heard stories of 4.7 V8's easy to overheat but again stories...have never had first hand experience or know someone personal who has had issues.

I suppose if you get the vehicle for R100K, and then spend another R50K on injectors and glow plugs the thing will go for another 300 000km and you still have a vehicle cheaper and better in almost every respect than a Corolla/Polo that costs the same or more.
Hell if I pulled the trigger on the Wrangler I was also looking at I would still be R150 000 worse off financially even disregarding interest on that.

Same could be said for the KK though. Lots of vehicle for your money. I really liked my KJ as well. Underrated offroad and the KK is even better with it's traction control.

BTW:
What happens when injectors start to go? I mean how do you know and what is the consequence or cause?
No start or limp mode or kaboom engine?

[Rainier Vermaak]

Got a WK 3.0 CRD and had a KJ 3.7
THe KJ was a cool vehicle, then when looking for a Jeep again earlier last year went to look at KK's and WK's as well as the XK (Commander)
The KK can be done up real nice and looks great. Also the 3.7 on that body has got quite a bit of go. The KJ gearbox was crappy though imho. The KK has the same one.
After sitting in the WK's and XK's the KK interior felt cheap and quite a lot smaller.
After driving the 3.0CRD and 4.7/5.7 V8's they felt under-powered

You get a lot more "vehicle-for-money" with the WK/XK's but yeah maybe a bit more money if crap goes wrong.

I've also heard injector horror stories at first....then saw that places like ANG / UAP etc can fit them for...although stil expensive, for much less.
I have ALSO heard but not sure how valid it is that you can go to Bosch directly and get them or go to Merc Indies who can get you new ones or ones that came from accident damaged vehicles.

So at least there are options since the Engine and Gearbox is straight out of he Mercs. Lots of German and Merc indies around.
I loved my Defender for what it was. The WK is none of that. The WK has really grown on me though...so much so that I'll almost say it's the best vehicle I've owned so far. Swambo also loves to drive it. Very practical as well, low on fuel for such a vehicle, powerful, spacious, looks good, all the creature comforts, can do offroad pretty damn well, and can cruise in town or on the highway no issues without breaking the bank in fuel bills and having to stop every 250km's to fill up every trip you take. Very few of them get modified so If you lift it add some tyres you have something a little more unique looking than the average 4x4 I guess if that floats your boat.

Not sure how the 3.7 is in the WK but thats also an option. Very reliable engine. I wanted to try one but it was out of town and I wanted Command Trac 2 - that was non negotiable. I heard stories of 4.7 V8's easy to overheat but again stories...have never had first hand experience or know someone personal who has had issues.

I suppose if you get the vehicle for R100K, and then spend another R50K on injectors and glow plugs the thing will go for another 300 000km and you still have a vehicle cheaper and better in almost every respect than a Corolla/Polo that costs the same or more.
Hell if I pulled the trigger on the Wrangler I was also looking at I would still be R150 000 worse off financially even disregarding interest on that.

Same could be said for the KK though. Lots of vehicle for your money. I really liked my KJ as well. Underrated offroad and the KK is even better with it's traction control.

BTW:
What happens when injectors start to go? I mean how do you know and what is the consequence or cause?
No start or limp mode or kaboom engine?

The Jeep turns into old smokey.

[Forest Fab]

Nox, thank you very much for your detailed answer.
Although it doesn't help with the WK/KK dilemma, but the truth is that there is not one vastly better (or worse) than the other. In the end it would come down to personal preference, and the opportunity of what's available at that time. I don't mind the XK, there seem to be a few more second hand than the KKs at the moment, at "reasonable" prices as well. Mostly HEMIs though.

I responded to your questions/comments in the quote below in red.

Thanks again!
Fab.

Got a WK 3.0 CRD and had a KJ 3.7
THe KJ was a cool vehicle, then when looking for a Jeep again earlier last year went to look at KK's and WK's as well as the XK (Commander)
The KK can be done up real nice and looks great. Also the 3.7 on that body has got quite a bit of go. The KJ gearbox was crappy though imho. The KK has the same one. yeah I also read a lot of accounts of automatic gearbox problems
After sitting in the WK's and XK's the KK interior felt cheap and quite a lot smaller.
After driving the 3.0CRD and 4.7/5.7 V8's they felt under-powered
Above two comments are interesting and expected, although I would have imagined that the 5.7 would have had some oomph. Probably a matter of having to rev the V8 to get something out of it, as opposed to the low down torque of the V6 diesel?

You get a lot more "vehicle-for-money" with the WK/XK's but yeah maybe a bit more money if crap goes wrong.

I've also heard injector horror stories at first....then saw that places like ANG / UAP etc can fit them for...although stil expensive, for much less.
I have ALSO heard but not sure how valid it is that you can go to Bosch directly and get them or go to Merc Indies who can get you new ones or ones that came from accident damaged vehicles. Yes, you can get Bosch injectors without going through the agents. On my KJ it was less expensive (R3900 VS R5500), but I didn't go this route as a refurb was sufficient (R4k for two).

So at least there are options since the Engine and Gearbox is straight out of he Mercs. Lots of German and Merc indies around.
I loved my Defender for what it was. The WK is none of that. The WK has really grown on me though...so much so that I'll almost say it's the best vehicle I've owned so far. Swambo also loves to drive it. Very practical as well, low on fuel for such a vehicle, powerful, spacious, looks good, all the creature comforts, can do offroad pretty damn well, and can cruise in town or on the highway no issues without breaking the bank in fuel bills and having to stop every 250km's to fill up every trip you take. Very few of them get modified so If you lift it add some tyres you have something a little more unique looking than the average 4x4 I guess if that floats your boat. Yes, that will float my boat All your comments here are like music to my ears, although I'd like to hear from a KK owner if they do or don't get the same feeling.
The "Merc" argument is a double edged sword I think. It can be good, it can be bad...
Also, what fuel consumption do you get?

Not sure how the 3.7 is in the WK but thats also an option. Very reliable engine. I wanted to try one but it was out of town and I wanted Command Trac 2 - that was non negotiable. I heard stories of 4.7 V8's easy to overheat but again stories...have never had first hand experience or know someone personal who has had issues.

I suppose if you get the vehicle for R100K, and then spend another R50K on injectors and glow plugs the thing will go for another 300 000km and you still have a vehicle cheaper and better in almost every respect than a Corolla/Polo that costs the same or more.
Hell if I pulled the trigger on the Wrangler I was also looking at I would still be R150 000 worse off financially even disregarding interest on that. Still a lot of money in my eyes at the moment, but who knows maybe further down the line It'll look better to me

Same could be said for the KK though. Lots of vehicle for your money. I really liked my KJ as well. Underrated offroad and the KK is even better with it's traction control. I hear you...

BTW:
What happens when injectors start to go? I mean how do you know and what is the consequence or cause?
No start or limp mode or kaboom engine? I had a misfire at idle, but was running fine higher in the revs. Whatever was wrong inside the injectors (springs, friction) prevented adequate fuelling at idle. If you leave it like this, it will worsen: rougher idle and start misfiring at higher revs. In the beginning it was only misfiring when cold, eventually it did it all the time. I removed the injectors to have them tested and two had to be attended to.

[Rainier Vermaak]

Nox, thank you very much for your detailed answer.
Although it doesn't help with the WK/KK dilemma, but the truth is that there is not one vastly better (or worse) than the other. In the end it would come down to personal preference, and the opportunity of what's available at that time. I don't mind the XK, there seem to be a few more second hand than the KKs at the moment, at "reasonable" prices as well. Mostly HEMIs though.

I responded to your questions/comments in the quote below in red.

Thanks again!
Fab.

The KK is a capable SUV, but the WK is just in another league when it comes to ride comfort, space and power plants.

The WK will be older, but with proper maintenance they are very reliable.

Best vehicle I have ever owned, and the most comfortable over long distances.

[Forest Fab]

The KK is a capable SUV, but the WK is just in another league when it comes to ride comfort, space and power plants.

The WK will be older, but with proper maintenance they are very reliable.

Best vehicle I have ever owned, and the most comfortable over long distances.

Thanks!

Are you talking about the KK about experience?

[Rainier Vermaak]

Thanks!

Are you talking about the KK about experience?

Drove one for a few days.

[Forest Fab]

Oh boy
https://www.gumtree.co.za/a-cars-bak...60910001970109

[Rainier Vermaak]

Oh boy
https://www.gumtree.co.za/a-cars-bak...60910001970109

Nice, but R200000 accessories?

Methinks the pig is being tossed.

[Forest Fab]

Yeah I don't even want to know how much he wants for it
But it does look nice

[Nox]

Nox, thank you very much for your detailed answer.
Although it doesn't help with the WK/KK dilemma, but the truth is that there is not one vastly better (or worse) than the other. In the end it would come down to personal preference, and the opportunity of what's available at that time. I don't mind the XK, there seem to be a few more second hand than the KKs at the moment, at "reasonable" prices as well. Mostly HEMIs though.

I responded to your questions/comments in the quote below in red.

Thanks again!
Fab.

Thanks for your explanation - good to know it doesn't just go boom but there are indications of the injectors going.
When I was talking about lack of power I mant the 3.0 CRD V6 4.7 V8 and 5.7Hemi made the 3.7 KK and KJ felt weak
The 4.7 V8 and 3.0 CRD is very comparable - when you do a GDE tune like Rainier did it goes to the 3.0 CRD, the HEmi is another animal though
THis is my first Diesel ever but I can see why people grow to love them. Lots of little things that make me like it, low down power, the little diesel chatter the turbo spool etc.

I almost bought a similar specced XK for R178 000 but then I thought it was too much and I wasn't really looking at Diesel.. test drove one and then kinda rang up the dealer to go test drive and hopefully buy that one only to be told a guy from Natal bought it and is picking it up later that day.
it only had 85 000km on and full suspension mods etc etc. As per one in your pic. You snooze you lose.
Later I picked up my WK for a lot less but it was stock accept for a spacer lift.

Other than reliability - which for me is too early to tell - the WK is, to me at least, an exceptional vehicle esp considering the price they go for pre-owned.

[Forest Fab]

Thanks Nox for your clarification on the CRD-5.7-Hemi VS 3.7 comment. It makes more sense
The Hemi is still attractive to me...
I'm guessing in the WK Hemi there was no shutting off 4 cylinders when cruising? Only on the WK2?
My wife's late uncle was only swearing by his Hemi... He sold it for a brand new Pajero DiD, and missed it every day...


Thanks again everyone for your comments. Obviously this is still a long term thing for me, but I think I'll go for test drives when WKs, KKs or XKs are for sale in my vicinity so that I can make my own opinion 8)

[skala]

WK hemi same as WK2; activates MDS must just use 5W20 oil.

[Dion]

WK hemi same as WK2; activates MDS must just use 5W20 oil.

Some 2010 Wk hemi's had the VVT engines as well and all models thereafter. All Grand Hemi's have the MDS system and the system works only correctly with the prescribed oils. The new version of the 5.7L has five different camshaft profiles. All will have VCT.

• Active intake with MDS
• Active intake without MDS
• Passive intake with MDS
• Passive intake without MDS
• HEV Application (modified version of passive intake with MDS)

[Forest Fab]

Thanks guys.
A quick look on Wikipedia confirmed that it started in 2004 (at least in the US).
But for the life of me I'm sure I had another acronym in mind - MDS does not ring a bell... Anyways, nothing to loose sleep over.

So, on my "to test drive list":
1. WK Hemi
2. XK Hemi
3. WK CRD
4. XK CRD
5. why was I thinking about a KK again?

[Dion]

Thanks guys.
A quick look on Wikipedia confirmed that it started in 2004 (at least in the US).
But for the life of me I'm sure I had another acronym in mind - MDS does not ring a bell... Anyways, nothing to loose sleep over.

So, on my "to test drive list":
1. WK Hemi
2. XK Hemi
3. WK CRD
4. XK CRD
5. why was I thinking about a KK again?

Wrong order. The CRD for me if I could to choose for you. There is not such a big difference in performance (especially without cat and EGR disabled with the Green software tune for the CRD) and taking into account what you pay extra for petrol. When I had the Hemi and on weekends had to go somewhere the Jeep usually stayed in the garage because of its drinking habits. With the diesel it's the reverse. Leave my bakkie and take the Jeep. Both were my holiday car's and to tow for a weekend away, but with the CRD I roughly travel double the kilometers per year than what I did with the Hemi just because its so much lighter on fuel. Have added a WK 2 CRD now but I still think that Merc V6 is a remarkable and reliable engine and glad that I kept it, as the trade in values are what they are.

I had the V8 Jeeps from a WJ and two WK's and nothing wrong with them but the diesel tows better and is more than a third more economical. Sitting in the WK CRD when travelling and it sounds like a petrol V6 and not a diesel. I do not miss the V8's, I just hope that the Italian V6 will give me as much joy as the Merc still do.

But drive them yourself, you wont be sorry about any of the Wk's or a Commander. If you really have to buy a KK go with the 3.7. The 2.8 CRD is not very economical and does have issues when older. A drop valve in the 3.7 is a rarity. Its just that four speed gearbox.

[Forest Fab]

Thanks Dion, you're really adding weight on the diesel side. I'll definitely have to test both CRD and Hemi to make up my mind, and look more closely at the actual world fuel consumption.
In your opinion, the MDS on the Hemi didn't give such a big improvement?

Going back to the KK, I think I'd look for a manual CRD, but I could also test the 3.7 auto to have a feel for it. At the moment, I'm not too keen on it

[big sam]

I have a KK 3.7 for 3+ years now...never had any problems...it is a daily driver and tow my cj or tj around to events...I luv it and there is nothing I can complain about.. open road 9km per liter .. not to bad...