Towing with a Hilux or Fortuner

[Uys]

http://www.wheels24.co.za/Wheels24/N...323064,00.html

South African bakkie and SUV owners, much like their American and Australian counterparts, love towing.
And not just any towing. We love towing big rigs across huge distances, especially during December when the scramble for some coastal R&R transplants most the Gauteng urban population.

Fortuner and Hilux 'unsafe' towing rigs?

Unfortunately South Africa also hosts horrific road accident statistics when totalled up at the end of each year.
This December was no different, and lately some caravan, trailer and boat owners who tow have started to mumble about the stability of their Toyota Fortuner and Hilux double-cab vehicles.
Some allege the best-selling bakkie and SUV ranges in South Africa exhibit a disconcerting instability when towing, resulting in accidents.
These are rather weighty allegations, especially as Toyota sells around 500 Fortuners a month locally.
Wheels24 was invited this week to the Gerotek vehicle test facility outside Pretoria to evaluate the towing stability of the Fortuner and Hilux range for ourselves.

Not a happy camper

With Jurgens Caravans hitched to standard mounted tow bars we set off on a 50-km route. It was not a happy experience.
Above 70 km/h, the Caravan swayed like a drunken matric dance date and there was a terrible vertical tremor that reverberated through the driver seat over surface irregularities and even on smooth downhill surfaces.
I was driving a D-4D Fortuner and an epic sense of relief rushed over me we came to a stop to swap drivers.
Around the halfway point we stopped for a snack and re-hitched the Caravans before making our way back to Gerotek.
Although I do not recommend motoring above 80km/h whilst towing, on the way back I got up to a stable 120km/h with the sway and chassis tremors banished.
I immediately thought somebody had put something in the soft-drinks we had had at the halfway point; there was simply no other explanation for the newfound stability and towing prowess - same Caravans, same cars, same tyres, same tow bar...

Drop it like it's hot

Admittedly there was one difference. Both the Fortuner and double-cab D-4D models were equipped with a standard tow bar, mounted at approximately 600 mm.
This is way above the SABS recommended tow height maximum of 465 mm, and to get it within the correct height of between 350-465 mm clearance you would have to weigh your Hilux or Fortuner down with a full payload - and who does that when they're towing?
At 600 mm, the angle of connection with the Caravan is raised and sets the weight distribution bias behind the Caravan rear axle, doing little to aid stability.
Reduce the attachment angle to between 0.5- and 1.0 degree and you have an ideal set-up. To achieve this we simply unhitched the Caravans at the halfway point and attached them to the secondary tow bar which was mounted on a drop-plate, dropping the tow bar by about 155 mm.
Tyre pressures throughout the exercise were at a maximum manufacturer recommendation. Towing with the drop-plate fitted tow bars, the Fortuner and Hilux performed faultlessly. These vehicles are highly competent towing rigs, no doubt about it.

Be meticulous

So who is at fault? Obviously excessive speeds and negligent tyre-pressure guides are a huge source of towing accidents, but the use of a drop plate on vehicles with 4x4 levels of ground clearance is essential in my view.
You simply cannot tow safely with an inclined connection angle, and with most 4x4 vehicles and standard tow bar mount heights this is exactly what you are going to end up with.
So keep those tyre pressures up, use a drop plate on your 4x4 when towing and you should be arrive at your destination safely and mostly unaware that you have just towed something the size of a small house.
And even though modern vehicles have more than enough torque compared to towing options available to the public just ten years ago, see the abundance of power as a means of powering up inclines safely and running at the most economical point in the rev range, the torque peak.
The extra power is not meant to enable towing at 140km/h or even 120km/h, tow at 80km/h, which is what local driving instructor Basil Mann recommend I do as he chaperoned me in the passenger seat along the route.
And if you think Mann is being overly cautious and silly, this is a driver who beat Ayrton Senna at the beginning, and competed against Michael Schumacher at the end of his racing career in Europe, so I would be inclined to heed his advice.
Many 4x4 owners complain about the chore of removing a drop-plate (you cannot really go-off with one admittedly), but honestly, what is the price coefficient of tightening or replacing a couple of bolts less than a dozen times a year compared to the safety of your family?

[swainsons]

Experienced towers know all this. It is vital to have the correct setups and speed is a killer. With a caravan at the back stay below a 100km/h.

I know that some Fortuner guys have put airbags at the back to help and that certainly also makes a difference.

Personally, I tow an camping/off road trailer, and I have not had any bad experiences, but I make sure all the required parameters are met.... Oh, and the Koni shocks also help a lot.

Regards,

[ThomasT]

As Swainsons has said. If you set up the rig correctly there is no problems at all. I towed the Xplorer from R/Bay to Chobe and back with out any hassles and there was stages that we where up to 120 Km/hr.

The most inportant thing is to get to know the rig and realise that you need to adjust according to you loading. ie I know that I can't use the same set up and supspension pressures if I am not fully loaded as per the Bots trip cos then the rig will run nose up and that makes for some pretty exciting driving.

[Biscut]

What I fail to understand is that Toyota is aware of this problem (even highlight it in a test), but does not take corrective action? The Toyota factory fitted towbars is standard without a drop plate, there is also no advise regarding the recommendation of fitting one? . I am not an experienced tower (if that is a word?) and thus depend on OEM equipment. Why accept the fact that there is a potential problem, but apart from informing owners fail to resolve the problem?

Having said that, I have towed a medium sized boat (without a drop plate) and did not experience any swaying etc, nor am I aware of any manufacturer that by deafult fits a dropplate if the hitch is higher than the SABS requirement?

[Bryan Webber]

I cant comment on the FT. However I tow a lot with the hilux. From my 19ft boat to 2.5ton loaded trailers and I have not had a issue at all. I dont tow faster than 80-100km/h though! EVen now lifted with bigger tyres towing is not a problem.

Something I want to bring up is I really cant see how this vehicles stability is so "problematic." I have had many double cabs and singlecabs and while I do admit on gravel the new hilux can become a handful I blame the tyres and extra power for that. Once I fitted the 31" gravel road ability trippled. I also found with the std tyres when cornering at speed but nowhere near the vehicles limit the front tyres would start squeeling and want to break loose off the road. Now with the bigger tyres I have pushed the vehicle hard around those same corners with no sign of the tyres wanting to break free.

At the end of the day, any vehicle not setup correctly and most importantly driven incorrectly will give issues when towing. I dont believe the hilux is any worse or better when it comes to towing compared to other vehicles.

[Arie]

I tow a boat and trailer on a regular basis. HAve not had any problems to date. In fact, I have had a tyre blowout on the boat trailer, and the Fortuner handled it with ease. This happened before I had any mods, only LR Tank

[Stoney]

Well guys, I have listed my problem on the other thread and was present at the Toy SA meeting at Donkerhoek PTA in Aug. Their Leon and Ferdi
made arrangements to test my FT and Caravan (Penta 2007) due to the FT swaing that occurs at a speed of +/- 90k/ph. This was done on the 25 Sept. 1) Firstly to my normal spec setup (includes everything as per Wheels24 test). My original grabbers were replaced in June. 2)Then they changed the tyres to the new grabbers and weight everything and checked all details to their spec's.

Their test drivers Grant, John and Bryan, Titus their field technical guys from their HQ were present in the FT while testing it on the N4.The first run was done between speeds of 90 - 110 k/ph. (Before anybody say the speed for towing is 100 k/ph remember that there are times that you will exceed it) This was done with a Straight liner stabilizer. At 100k/ph the FT was loose on the road with the back fish-tailing so much that they even felt it at the back by asking if the steering wheel is being played with.

The second round was with their changes and without the stabilizer. The result was that immediately you felt the FT loose on the road and could not up the speed to 100k/ph, stopped put the stabilizer back and we could achieve the speed of a 100/110k/ph. The FT felt better, but again a stabilizer is their to assit and secure better handling over and above normal towing of a vehicle. My understanding.

They all agreed their is a problem and took the FT for it's 3rd set of tyres and technical check at their Sandton HQ. The FT was returned and I went to Bela Bela the weekend to test. Slight improvement but still loose
at speeds of 100k/ph. Reported back with all details and offered to take a Prado. They Offered me R250K trade in. My FT is a 2007 4L 4x4 auto with R18k extras with only !8000km on the clock. Sucks!!

I can not repeat what I said to them and with the last correspondence to them all including Ferdi and Leon I am still waiting on the next step to sort my problem that their guys agreed do exist. I am now fighting since January and still not sorted. Must we just sit back and wait?

PS :The caravan was tested and we tested with a 2nd one aswell

[Dif]

They all agreed their is a problem and took the FT for it's 3rd set of tyres and technical check at their Sandton HQ. The FT was returned and I went to Bela Bela the weekend to test. Slight improvement but still loose
at speeds of 100k/ph. Reported back with all details and offered to take a Prado. They Offered me R250K trade in. My FT is a 2007 4L 4x4 auto with R18k extras with only !8000km on the clock. Sucks!!

I can not repeat what I said to them and with the last correspondence to them all including Ferdi and Leon I am still waiting on the next step to sort my problem that their guys agreed do exist. I am now fighting since January and still not sorted. Must we just sit back and wait?

PS :The caravan was tested and we tested with a 2nd one aswell

Stoney.

This is shocking to say the least! This is an admission that they cannot cure your problem or doesn't know why this happens. Very similar to the gravel problem.

It clearly contradicts the reports that Toyota published in the Wegsleep / Gerotek test with the drop-plate.

Perhaps it's time for a follow-up to be published in Wegsleep. Perhaps you should contact Adrian for this story (the journo who attended the test).

Regards.

[Jengel]

It is important to take note of the following issues when towing. Experienced people towing for many years will confirm this as well as manufacturers:
1. The towed unit (caravan/trailer) must look down towards the tow vehicle. The tow hitch must be lower than the towed unit's wheel centre line by at least 50mm.
2. The rated maximum weight on the tow bar of the vehicle is 80kg. This is sometimes too low as I found it to be optimum around a 10th of the towed mass. For a 1000kg caravan a mass of 100kg on the nose give very stable performance.
3. Packing of the towed unit is the most important issue. Prevent the "Grandfather Clock Pendulum" action by loading the heavy items on or just in front of the towed units axle. Bulky light weight items can be placed at the back. Watch where the tent in packed!
4. Tyre pressure on the towed unit is vitally important. Too hard and it runs too light on the road and will jump, hop and skip all over.
5. The use of an Anit Sway bar system is needed. A cross wind will prove that to you as you pass a truck or bridge.
6. A high lifted vehicle is already an unstable towing unit due to the higher centre of gravity. You can offset the towed unit's centre line by fitting larger wheels (13" to 14" or 14" to 15") if they can fit in the wheel well.
7. Try to fit shock absorbers on the towed unit. It does wonders!
8. The tow vehicle must be heavier than the towed mass!
I'm sure many more items can be listed to this list. I have towed caravans, trailers, boats and military tanks in my time. Know your rig and it's limitations!
Johan

[Stoney]

Hi Johan,
I fully agree with your details, But maybe if you read my post again you will notice that all spec's were adhered to and this is not my first time towing and that my previous vehicle was a Disco 2 V8 and many other before. In the towing test all items were moved around to their request to get the balance right, but to no avail. Stabilizers are their for exactly your comment to assist you, not to correct the towing vehicle basic abilities.

My biggest concern is that the FT should without any upgrades be able to tow this vehicle without any problem. Must we wait till LIVES are lost. The FT's that rolled while towing were people with years of experience of towing. I personally was with my family in about 80% roll, fortunately managed to save the situation. What will happen to those that do not know about this problem on the FT and maybe towing for the first time with this vehicle the coming holidays. Scary!!

[Liaan]

No Vehicle with a high mounted towbar can tow a normal caravan or small wheeled heavy trailer safely without fitting a drop plate.

End of story.

[Stoney]

No Vehicle with a high mounted towbar can tow a normal caravan or small wheeled heavy trailer safely without fitting a drop plate.

End of story.

Hi ToyotaMan

This vehicle is fitted with a dropplate and the test was done with it.

Now where does the story end now!!

[JAS]

Fortuner Towing with a Hilux or Fortuner

H2f -- Are you now including the Hilux in the debacle

Agreeing with Bryan here, I have not heard of the SRA (Solid rear axle) Hilux with leaf springs giving any towing problems !!

Yes the Hilux is definitely not the best on dirt road, but has never been, even my old KZ could not stay with an Isuzu on a dirt road.

But must say Toyota has realy thumbled the handling (no pun intended) of the Fortuner towing issue.

[Uys]

H2f -- Are you now including the Hilux in the debacle

Not at all - I merely posted the article here!

[Christo Davids]

Kan nie kommentaar lewer op die FT towing nie, maar 'n hilux sleep baie lekker

Ek het al baie perde met 'n Hilux gesleep en weet van BAIE mense wat baie groot horseboxes baie suksesvol met hul hiluxe sleep

[RiaandL]

Well guys, I have listed my problem on the other thread and was present at the Toy SA meeting at Donkerhoek PTA in Aug. Their Leon and Ferdi
made arrangements to test my FT and Caravan (Penta 2007) due to the FT swaing that occurs at a speed of +/- 90k/ph. This was done on the 25 Sept. 1) Firstly to my normal spec setup (includes everything as per Wheels24 test). My original grabbers were replaced in June. 2)Then they changed the tyres to the new grabbers and weight everything and checked all details to their spec's.

Their test drivers Grant, John and Bryan, Titus their field technical guys from their HQ were present in the FT while testing it on the N4.The first run was done between speeds of 90 - 110 k/ph. (Before anybody say the speed for towing is 100 k/ph remember that there are times that you will exceed it) This was done with a Straight liner stabilizer. At 100k/ph the FT was loose on the road with the back fish-tailing so much that they even felt it at the back by asking if the steering wheel is being played with.

The second round was with their changes and without the stabilizer. The result was that immediately you felt the FT loose on the road and could not up the speed to 100k/ph, stopped put the stabilizer back and we could achieve the speed of a 100/110k/ph. The FT felt better, but again a stabilizer is their to assit and secure better handling over and above normal towing of a vehicle. My understanding.

They all agreed their is a problem and took the FT for it's 3rd set of tyres and technical check at their Sandton HQ. The FT was returned and I went to Bela Bela the weekend to test. Slight improvement but still loose
at speeds of 100k/ph. Reported back with all details and offered to take a Prado. They Offered me R250K trade in. My FT is a 2007 4L 4x4 auto with R18k extras with only !8000km on the clock. Sucks!!

I can not repeat what I said to them and with the last correspondence to them all including Ferdi and Leon I am still waiting on the next step to sort my problem that their guys agreed do exist. I am now fighting since January and still not sorted. Must we just sit back and wait?

PS :The caravan was tested and we tested with a 2nd one aswell

Hi guys,

I have to agree with Stoney. I bought my V6 FT in May this year. Since I had the FT, I towed many 6ft trailers, large 4x4 trailers and have done several off-road trips, with fully loaded roofrack and loaded trailer and never had an issue. Even the infamous gravel road issues never posed a problem to me....

Then, earlier this month I decided to take the kids for a caravan weekend and we had the most horrific experience towing. I also have a Penta 2007. Going away for only a weekend, I would suggest that the van was loaded way below the normal weight, and was packed in a way that would be well balanced.
I have heard all about the towing issues (and although I have never experienced this) I took the precautions. Fitted a drop plate to the FT, added a Trapezium stabilizer and made 100% sure I have the tyre pressures to the specified mark - 210.
At 80kmp I could not keep the FT going in a straight line!!! I have no idea why this would be - why such a remarkable difference Maybe becuase the smaller trailers can not present similar load weights, and the larger trailers have 15" wheels? Maybe because with the drop-plate, the van's nose was too low and caused the imbalance? I do not know....
I can confirm that I have towed this very same van with my Colt at speeds up to 130kmp without EVER having any issues. My Colt NEVER had stabilizers, nor drop-plates fitted. I have towed this van with my BMW330d as well... MUCH smaller car and far lighter than the van. MUCH lower than the van and could comfortably tow the van at speeds of 130kmp?

We need to find a way to fix this - I have the FT and apart from this, I love the car. I just need to know how to fix this issue.

I will appreciate feedback and input

[Family_Dog]

Hi Riaan,

If I read this correctly, your FT tyres were pumped only at 2.1 bar? That is far too low for towing purposes, you would need to go to a bare minimum of 2.5 bar, probably better off at 2.8 - 3 bar or thereabouts.


-F_D

[Jolli Trolli]

Ek sleep karavaan sedert 1986 en my huidige karavaan (Sprite Major) is nuut gekoop in 1987 en het nou 90 000 km gedoen.
Ek het ook 'n 2007 Jurgens Explorer wat ek sedert Junie 2007 sleep.

Ek het my Fortuner Sept 2007 gekry en het nog steeds die oorspronklike bande en vering stelsel (48 000 km). Sedertdien het ek die Major 3 805 km en Explorer 1 725 km met hom gesleep.

Alhoewel ek hanteringsprobleme het met die Fortuner solo op sinkplaat grondpad, is daar geen probleme op teer as ek sleep nie. Die tye wat ek die Explorer wel op 'n grondpad gesleep het was die pad toestande goed en het ek nie 80 km/uur oorskry nie, dus daar was geen probleme nie.

My karavane se bande is 3 bar en Fortuner agterbande 2,5 bar gepomp.
As ek die Major sleep gebruik ek 'n hangplaat en Trapezuim stabiliseerder.
Wanneer ek die Explorer sleep word geen hangplaat of stabiliseerder gebruik nie.

Let ook op dat die oorspronklike Grabber bande 'n maksimum toelaatbare druk van 3 bar het - dit word op die sywand van die band aangetoon.

[RiaandL]

thanks guys,

which brings us to another interesting issue. I have read all the user manuals, checked all the Toyota technical bulletins and even called Toyota dealerships, and absolutelu no-one couls confirm towing tyre pressures. the best I could get from anyone / resource, was to keep tyre pressures standard at 2.1bar.

I have now decided to fit BFG AT tyres and next week I will also get the air-pump shock devices fitted, as I was told this should sort any stability issues out

I will report back once I have this fitted.

Anyone with feedback / advise on this will be appreciated

[Stoney]

thanks guys,

which brings us to another interesting issue. I have read all the user manuals, checked all the Toyota technical bulletins and even called Toyota dealerships, and absolutelu no-one couls confirm towing tyre pressures. the best I could get from anyone / resource, was to keep tyre pressures standard at 2.1bar.

I have now decided to fit BFG AT tyres and next week I will also get the air-pump shock devices fitted, as I was told this should sort any stability issues out

I will report back once I have this fitted.

Anyone with feedback / advise on this will be appreciated

Hi Guys

Sitting and watching the ocean at Hartenbos after what was a nightmare last year with towing I can report the following.

My FT is now fitted with Old Man Emo Shocks (Only) and airbags. My tyres changed to 17'' Bridgestones 265/65/17 on a 8'' rim. While I was towing my tyre pressure was as follow: Front 2.4 Bar Rear 3.0 Bar and airbags 1.5 bar. Fully load-en Penta and 5 people for a 3 week holiday.

The result

I left Pta still uncertain but a total changed FT. Not even my Disco has done better. No swagging and I could drive at any speed relaxed.
Now I can say that I enjoy this vehicle to its fullness.

Riaandl

What you must test is the front shocks of your FT. Seeing that you were towing and the problem only started now, it was exactly my problem and all the time we waisted looking for the problem at the back. Good Luck.