Electrickery for camping - Page 55





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  1. #1081
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
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    Paarl
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    51
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    48

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Your expertise on the below would be appreciated.

    I have built in an intelligent battery charger (Victron 12v/15A) into my Ranger for the times we are camping at sites with power. To avoid having cables all over the place, I installed an external IP67 caravan type plug on the outside of my RSi canopy (picture below).

    The battery charger has a two pole plug which I plan on cutting off and connecting to the external caravan plug. The external power source from campsite is 3 pole.

    The question - should I earth the caravan plug on canopy to the body, or would it not really serve a purpose? There is a canopy support bolt (attached to steel bracket on body of vehicle) just below the caravan plug which could easily be used as earth?

    Many thanks.


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    Brian

    2016 Ford Ranger XLT 3.2 Dcab 4x4
    2016 Conqueror Courage

  2. #1082
    Join Date
    Jan 2016
    Location
    Moloto Road,R573
    Age
    49
    Posts
    67

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Good day,
    If you want to earth any 220 Volt, I wouldn't earth it to the vehicle cause the vehicle stands on rubber wheels, isolating it from earth,,, do you remember the old cars used to have a chain hanging from the body to the ground. That will earth the vehicle. Maybe not secure but in most cases it should work.
    BIGGER THE BUILD-UP,,,THE BIGGER THE BLOW

  3. #1083
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Bryanston
    Age
    36
    Posts
    146

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Good afternoon helpful forumites

    I have recently bought a trailer with a Victron Blue Power PWM (12/24). I have an 80W panel that I use on my truck, my intention is to buy another 80W panel and build a solar suitcase for use on the trailer. But I see that the PWM can take maximum 55V only. How would I connect the panels not to exceed the voltage? What would happen if the voltage were to exceed 55V?

    Thanks

    Liam

  4. #1084
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Ellisras
    Age
    56
    Posts
    687

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by LiamG View Post
    Good afternoon helpful forumites

    I have recently bought a trailer with a Victron Blue Power PWM (12/24). I have an 80W panel that I use on my truck, my intention is to buy another 80W panel and build a solar suitcase for use on the trailer. But I see that the PWM can take maximum 55V only. How would I connect the panels not to exceed the voltage? What would happen if the voltage were to exceed 55V?

    Thanks

    Liam
    Connect them in parallel
    Join the + of both panels
    and join the - of both panels

    Your max voltage will be the same as for 1 panel

    If you join in series you will exceed 55V and the PWM might lose its smoke...
    2000 Patrol GU 4.2D(onkey) beyond 840 000 km

  5. #1085
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Bryanston
    Age
    36
    Posts
    146

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by Dungbeetle View Post
    Connect them in parallel
    Join the + of both panels
    and join the - of both panels

    Your max voltage will be the same as for 1 panel

    If you join in series you will exceed 55V and the PWM might lose its smoke...
    Brilliant thanks Dungbeetle

  6. #1086

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Liam, if you connect the panels is series you increase the voltage and the amperage remains the same. Parallel will keep the voltage the same and increase the amperage.
    Two panels in series will still be well below the Vmax of your victron. The great thing about having 2 panels installed in parallel is that if the controller fails when in the bush you can still charge your battery directly. Not ideal and you would need to keep an eye on things but it would work.

  7. #1087
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Ellisras
    Age
    56
    Posts
    687

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Careful

    We do not know what the Voc of Liam's panels are

    You do get 80W panels with 36V Voc...
    2000 Patrol GU 4.2D(onkey) beyond 840 000 km

  8. #1088
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Bryanston
    Age
    36
    Posts
    146

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by Dungbeetle View Post
    Careful

    We do not know what the Voc of Liam's panels are

    You do get 80W panels with 36V Voc...
    They're these jobbies https://www.4x4direct.co.za/fixed-so...l-18-volt.html

  9. #1089
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Florida
    Age
    67
    Posts
    2,707

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by LiamG View Post
    No problem the controller takes the 18V down to what is required to charge your 12V battery. The panel you have was designed for a 12v system. If you now want to get a 2nd panel put them in parallel and then you will be safe.

    If in series you need to just make sure that the controller can step the charge voltage down for your 12V battery setup.
    Last edited by TRON; 2019/02/11 at 04:49 PM.

  10. #1090
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Ellisras
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    56
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    687

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    BlueSolar PWM-Light 12/24-5 12/24-10 12/24-20 12/24-30Battery Voltage 12/24V with automatic system voltage detection
    Rated charge current 5 A 10 A 20 A 30 A
    Recommended solar array 36 cell for 12 V / 72 cell for 24 VAutomatic low voltage loaddisconnect

    Maximum solar voltage 28 V for a 12 V system and 55 V for a 24 V system

    (1)Self-consumption < 10 mAOverload protectionShut down after 60 s in case of 130% loadShut down after 5 s in case of 160% load
    Short circuit: immediate shut downGrounding Common positiveOperating temp. range -20 to +50°C (full load)Humidity (non condensing) Max 95 %

    Stick to Parallel........
    2000 Patrol GU 4.2D(onkey) beyond 840 000 km

  11. #1091
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Vanderbijlpark
    Posts
    74

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    I read in the 75/15 manual they recommend 2x 12v (36cell) panels in series or 1x 24V(72cell) panel.
    The higher voltage makes the regulator more efficient in the sense that it will provide charge for a larger part of the day, meaning the panels will reach a higher voltage earlier in the morning and stay at a higher voltage later in the day.
    I also assume the auto voltage detects means the regulator will step the voltage down to 12V for the battery?

    From the victron manual:
    For example:
    12V battery and mono- or polycristalline panels connected to a 75V controller
    ● Minimum number of cells in series: 36 (12V panel).
    ● Recommended number of cells for highest controller efficiency: 72
    (2x 12V panel in series or 1x 24V panel).
    ● Maximum: 108 cells (3x 12V panel in series)
    Last edited by Bosvark_1000; 2019/02/14 at 10:28 PM.

  12. #1092
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Wartburg
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    59
    Posts
    1,410

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by Bosvark_1000 View Post
    I read in the 75/15 manual they recommend 2x 12v (36cell) panels in series or 1x 24V(72cell) panel.
    The higher voltage makes the regulator more efficient in the sense that it will provide charge for a larger part of the day, meaning the panels will reach a higher voltage earlier in the morning and stay at a higher voltage later in the day.
    I also assume the auto voltage detects means the regulator will step the voltage down to 12V for the battery?

    From the victron manual:
    For example:
    12V battery and mono- or polycristalline panels connected to a 75V controller
    ● Minimum number of cells in series: 36 (12V panel).
    ● Recommended number of cells for highest controller efficiency: 72
    (2x 12V panel in series or 1x 24V panel).
    ● Maximum: 108 cells (3x 12V panel in series)
    The quoted controller efficiency is normally the efficiency of the controller converting the solar input to battery output, ie equipment efficiency. Generally, the higher the input voltage, the higher the efficiency.

    Then you have the "efficiency" you explained above


  13. #1093
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Vanderbijlpark
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    74

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by mikeml View Post
    The quoted controller efficiency is normally the efficiency of the controller converting the solar input to battery output, ie equipment efficiency. Generally, the higher the input voltage, the higher the efficiency.

    Then you have the "efficiency" you explained above
    Correct

    Then a "better" setup on the victron 75/15 will be 2x 100W 72cell panels in parallel. You increase the voltage so you should get longer hours of charging.

  14. #1094
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Cape Town
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    54
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    298

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    After my AGM decided that it will no longer accept a charge, I decided to give a lead crystal battery a go. No particular reason. I don't use my aux that often so it cannot do any harm to try another option.

    I use it for a 40l Engel and a few 12v attachments like lights and battery charging. Has a 500Watt inverter attached as well. Also plug my air pump into it but when the engine is running. Has a WRND dc/dc (with MPPT) with a 120Watt mojave solar panel for when I'm in camp on my bum with a cold one in the shade.

    So which lead crystal battery would you suggest please?
    Last edited by lirritma; 2019/02/19 at 08:55 AM.
    Gerrit Laubscher

    Angola sempre

  15. #1095
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Benoni
    Age
    29
    Posts
    23

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Ok so at the outset of my questions let me just say that I find electricity a very confusing topic and class those who understand it and work with it in the same category as wizards and snake charmers. Something beyond us mere mortals.

    Nevertheless I am trying to educate myself around this topic and have (I think) progressed quite far from my starting point.

    My question is when connecting a volt and amp meter per the 4x4 direct wiring diagram below, what is the amp meter actually measuring? Is it the current leaving the battery? Is it the current entering the battery? I presume that it is the former?

    Then if I follow ChrisF's guidelines from a few years ago (which I may be misinterpreting) and change the wiring from the diagram so that the WRND or other charger takes the place of the battery and the battery takes the place of the spotlight or load I should be able to tell what voltage and current is being put into the battery?
    Attached Images Attached Images  

  16. #1096
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    Nov 2008
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    Ellisras
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    687

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by Half-Pint View Post
    My question is when connecting a volt and amp meter per the 4x4 direct wiring diagram below, what is the amp meter actually measuring? Is it the current leaving the battery? Is it the current entering the battery? I presume that it is the former?
    Well both is correct as the current is the flow in the closed circuit - what is flowing out is also what is flowing in the battery, else something external is supplying or drawing....

    If you are going to add chargers etc. you need 2 of those meters
    - 1 in the load circuit
    - 1 in the charge circuit

    Or get one from HcdP - which measures bi-directional.
    It gives you positive when the load is less then the charge and negative when the load is more than the charge

    http://www.hcdpelectronics.co.za/ind...&product_id=60
    Last edited by Dungbeetle; 2019/02/20 at 10:39 AM.
    2000 Patrol GU 4.2D(onkey) beyond 840 000 km

  17. #1097
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    Feb 2008
    Location
    Cape Town
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    54
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    298

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by lirritma View Post
    After my AGM decided that it will no longer accept a charge, I decided to give a lead crystal battery a go. No particular reason. I don't use my aux that often so it cannot do any harm to try another option.

    I use it for a 40l Engel and a few 12v attachments like lights and battery charging. Has a 500Watt inverter attached as well. Also plug my air pump into it but when the engine is running. Has a WRND dc/dc (with MPPT) with a 120Watt mojave solar panel for when I'm in camp on my bum with a cold one in the shade.

    So which lead crystal battery would you suggest please?
    Anybody with input on my question? I got quote yesterday of R5000 for a 100Ah Lead Crystal battery from Batteries Online and it looks like it is a Betta Battery.
    Gerrit Laubscher

    Angola sempre

  18. #1098

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by lirritma View Post
    After my AGM decided that it will no longer accept a charge, I decided to give a lead crystal battery a go. No particular reason. I don't use my aux that often so it cannot do any harm to try another option.

    I use it for a 40l Engel and a few 12v attachments like lights and battery charging. Has a 500Watt inverter attached as well. Also plug my air pump into it but when the engine is running. Has a WRND dc/dc (with MPPT) with a 120Watt mojave solar panel for when I'm in camp on my bum with a cold one in the shade.

    So which lead crystal battery would you suggest please?
    I have 2 of the Deltec Lead Crystal 12V 100Ah which have been doing duty now for 5years and which I bought directly from Deltec in Alberton. One should be adequate to run all of the items that you have mentioned.

    It is also a Betta battery, and do I see that Deltec have a branch in Cape Town as well.
    Last edited by Rooikop; 2019/02/20 at 10:50 AM.
    Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication.
    - Leonardo Da Vinci
    Also on

  19. #1099
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Cape Town
    Age
    54
    Posts
    298

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by Rooikop View Post
    I have 2 of the Deltec Lead Crystal 12V 100Ah which have been doing duty now for 5years and which I bought directly from Deltec in Alberton. One should be adequate to run all of the items that you have mentioned.

    It is also a Betta battery, and do I see that Deltec have a branch in Cape Town as well.
    Thanks Rooikop. Do you have the BC-6CNFJ-90 or the BC-6CNFT-100 ?
    Gerrit Laubscher

    Angola sempre

  20. #1100
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Paarl
    Age
    51
    Posts
    48

    Default Re: Electrickery for camping

    Quote Originally Posted by lirritma View Post
    After my AGM decided that it will no longer accept a charge, I decided to give a lead crystal battery a go. No particular reason. I don't use my aux that often so it cannot do any harm to try another option.

    I use it for a 40l Engel and a few 12v attachments like lights and battery charging. Has a 500Watt inverter attached as well. Also plug my air pump into it but when the engine is running. Has a WRND dc/dc (with MPPT) with a 120Watt mojave solar panel for when I'm in camp on my bum with a cold one in the shade.

    So which lead crystal battery would you suggest please?
    There are a number of very good technical articles in the past month's SA4x4 magazine. A lot of good is said about the Discover Dry Traction batteries - slightly higher Ah (115Ah if I remember correctly) and longer lifespan. As far as I understand, the Lead Crystal batteries do not like a lot of shaking, whereas the Dry Traction is much more robust...
    Brian

    2016 Ford Ranger XLT 3.2 Dcab 4x4
    2016 Conqueror Courage

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