Insurance with out-of-country-cover for seven months

[GeorgeCH]

Hello everyone,

I am having a surprisingly hard time finding insurance that covers my car (owned by me, registered in South Africa) on a multi-month camping trip out of the country. My current findings are:

Outsurance: 1 month
Tuffstuff: 2 months
Santam: in contact, results pending
Intasure: declined
Genesib, idirect@absa: no reply yet

I guess many people had this problem before, anyone know other suitable insurance companies? And is there an alternative (e.g. getting insurance cover in the individual countries/at the borders)?

I'll post further results to put this information on record for future long-time-travellers.

Best,
Georg

[Apocalypse]

have you spoken to Raymond?

I'm surprised at that...

[GeorgeCH]

have you spoken to Raymond?

I'm surprised at that...

Yes, first thing I did. Raymond confirmed Tuffstuff can't do anything, and he didn't know any local company who does either.

[mfuwefarmer]

Even on a fully paid off vehicle? Wonder why the 2 month limitation? Might be SA insurance regulations!

Before registering my LC in Zambia I insured it locally although it was still on SA plates, maybe thats an option to consider although it might be expensive.

[Raymond du Plessis]

George, we will talk on Monday. PM me you tel number please

[Raymond du Plessis]

Yes, first thing I did. Raymond confirmed Tuffstuff can't do anything, and he didn't know any local company who does either.

But I find it difficult to take no for an answer
So today I managed to get something done for George....happy
Had a long chat with him about it and now waiting for him to get back to me with some answers.

[Disco-Deon]

So to understand this.
If I approach TS with my itinerary for a 6 month overlanding trip. Showing where I will be travelling, what precautions I have taken, what risk there is to TS - then they will approve or decline according to perceived risk and if approved they would quote me accordingly.

That is - Is it possible to get insurance for my trip?

[Raymond du Plessis]

So to understand this.
If I approach TS with my itinerary for a 6 month overlanding trip. Showing where I will be travelling, what precautions I have taken, what risk there is to TS - then they will approve or decline according to perceived risk and if approved they would quote me accordingly.

That is - Is it possible to get insurance for my trip?

TUFFSTUFF's crossborder time limit is 60 days in a 12 month period commencing from the date of the inception of the policy. This applies to to all cross border extensions of cover i.e. Repatriation/recovery of the vehicle following accident or breakdown, repatriation of the occupants of the vehicle where the vehicle needs to be repatriated, all emergency hotel and transport costs relative thereto, medical evacuation of any of the occupants of the vehicle and where needed, repatriation of the remaining occupants as a result of the medevac and emergency costs related to such repatriation. By going on an extended trip of six months as you suggest, these exposures are increased 3 fold and this is where we get stuck with insurers.

But, they put little cars on Mars so who knows when we can get Insurers to change their minds.

Another issue we are faced with is when travellers from other countries visit SA to travel overland. Premiums must obviously be paid to Insurers in Rands and claims must be paid in Rands. It is extremely difficult to pay any claim (in the event of a wright-off) into a foreign bank account. The Reserve Bank does not like it. Consequently, such foreign traveller will have to have a SA bank account into which such payment can be made and then the forex issue is his problem thereafter.

[Fluffy]

TUFFSTUFF's crossborder time limit is 60 days in a 12 month period commencing from the date of the inception of the policy. This applies to to all cross border extensions of cover i.e. Repatriation/recovery of the vehicle following accident or breakdown, repatriation of the occupants of the vehicle where the vehicle needs to be repatriated, all emergency hotel and transport costs relative thereto, medical evacuation of any of the occupants of the vehicle and where needed, repatriation of the remaining occupants as a result of the medevac and emergency costs related to such repatriation. By going on an extended trip of six months as you suggest, these exposures are increased 3 fold and this is where we get stuck with insurers.

But, they put little cars on Mars so who knows when we can get Insurers to change their minds.

That makes sense to me.

Insurance is a game of statistical probability. The insurers risk and costs of remediation are at the highest when across our borders.

The time that the vehicle is at this higher rate needs to be limited to a reasonable period.

[GeorgeCH]

But I find it difficult to take no for an answer

Yay, thank you very much! :-) I got you the details, let's see if this works.

Insurance is a game of statistical probability. The insurers risk and costs of remediation are at the highest when across our borders.

The time that the vehicle is at this higher rate needs to be limited to a reasonable period.

Or you pay extra, which would be totally fine as an option. If the risk can be calculated for two months, it should be possible to calculate it for seven months. And I could even do with less service. On such a long trip I have time, I can organize a recovery myself. I worry most about 3rd party liability and another driver without insurance totalling my car, and this I would very much like to have covered.

We all dream of that LONG trip, once we win the lotto .... just wondering how people arrange their short term (and medical) insurance for such extended trips ....

That one is easy to answer; for me it did not take winning the lottery. I have been living cheaply in a shared flat together with my girlfriend for the last few years and put some money on the side. Now the rooms are rented out, so we pay no rent. Still have the regular health insurance, and they allow extended trips. Came to Cape Town, bought an old but solid car (1988 Landcruiser), and did most of the outfitting on our own. Camping is comparatively affordable, we cook our own meals, bake our own bread; one of the biggest budget items is gas for the trip.

George

[Raymond du Plessis]

Yay, thank you very much! :-) I got you the details, let's see if this works.


Or you pay extra, which would be totally fine as an option. If the risk can be calculated for two months, it should be possible to calculate it for seven months. And I could even do with less service. On such a long trip I have time, I can organize a recovery myself. I worry most about 3rd party liability and another driver without insurance totalling my car, and this I would very much like to have covered.

Unfortunately, its not that simple. If it was, then we would not have the problem with which we are faced since there are other issues realting to this matter as was discussed with you. For the sake of this discussion:
1. we are faced with our forex laws since you are not a SA citizen. Paying the premium in SARands is not a problem. In the event of a write-off, there will be some serious issue getting the claim paid out to you in a foreign currency into an overseas bank account. Believe me....been there and dont want to do that again. Consequently, as I did discuss with you, you will need to open a Bank account in SA into which any such funds will be paid following any possible write-off. Thereafter, the repatriation of such funds to your home country will be your responsibility.


2. Looking at your post here, you are mostly concerned about the Third Party Liability aspect. Hetre, you are advised to buy this cover at each of the borders you cross before entering the relevant country. If it is Third Party only cover which you are concernrd about, then yes, we can easilt do this for you, but only for that period travelling inside SA.



That one is easy to answer; for me it did not take winning the lottery. I have been living cheaply in a shared flat together with my girlfriend for the last few years and put some money on the side. Now the rooms are rented out, so we pay no rent. Still have the regular health insurance, and they allow extended trips. Came to Cape Town, bought an old but solid car (1988 Landcruiser), and did most of the outfitting on our own. Camping is comparatively affordable, we cook our own meals, bake our own bread; one of the biggest budget items is gas for the trip.


George

My response in RED

[Zombicon]

Will Namibia fall in that category(60 days), as they're also Covered by TS?

Small question , just a Y or N....

[Raymond du Plessis]

Will Namibia fall in that category(60 days), as they're also Covered by TS?

Small question , just a Y or N....

Currently, If you are a SAfrican travelling into Namibia or a Namibian travelling into SA, the 60 day limit applies

[Elders]

Back to the topic -

Raymond you mention 60 days in the first 12 months of cover - do the 60 day limit apply to clients of 2, 3 or more years with TS ?

We all dream of that LONG trip, once we win the lotto .... just wondering how people arrange their short term (and medical) insurance for such extended trips ....

[Raymond du Plessis]

Back to the topic -

Raymond you mention 60 days in the first 12 months of cover - do the 60 day limit apply to clients of 2, 3 or more years with TS ?
the 60 day limit applies to each 12 month cycle using the inception date of the policy as the starting point for the first 60 day period. At the anniversary date (ie inception date + 1 year) then the 60m day cycle starts again.

We all dream of that LONG trip, once we win the lotto .... just wondering how people arrange their short term (and medical) insurance for such extended trips ....
as you are aware, TUFFSTUFF does provide medevac cover. If you need travel insurance, then that is a different ball game.

My response in red

[Elders]

Dankie Raymond

[Dirk]

Off topic comments removed. Normal programming may now resume.

[SinWolf]

Ok... So you can go on a four month trip if you plan your trip a year in advance?

If you know you want to do your trip from 01Jan 2015- 30 April 2015....

Cancel your tuffstuff insurance in Dec 2014 (get other insurance for a month or two)... Re-instate TuffStuff on 01 March 2014....

Now you can go on your trip... You'll have 60 days cover 01Jan 2015 - end of Feb...

Then, 1st of March, your new 12 month cycle starts, giving you another 60 days to cover March and April...

Easy

[Raymond du Plessis]

Ok... So you can go on a four month trip if you plan your trip a year in advance?

If you know you want to do your trip from 01Jan 2015- 30 April 2015....

Cancel your tuffstuff insurance in Dec 2014 (get other insurance for a month or two)... Re-instate TuffStuff on 01 March 2014....

Now you can go on your trip... You'll have 60 days cover 01Jan 2015 - end of Feb...

Then, 1st of March, your new 12 month cycle starts, giving you another 60 days to cover March and April...

Easy

And we do not keep a record of this??
This is referred to as selection... and second time 'round Insurers will probably say no

[SinWolf]

And we do not keep a record of this??
This is referred to as selection... and second time 'round Insurers will probably say no

It was a joke... Hence the smiley faces

Of course this will not work...