Defenders are unreliable...





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  1. #1
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    Default Defenders are unreliable...

    ... or so I thought. (dont stop reading just yet)

    Personally (IMHO), I think the Defender is the best looking 4x4 if you are into serious overlanding and offroading of course BUT oh dear, all the bad stories (IOHO) about reliability have made me steer well clear. Sometimes I wish my Prado had the Defender body on the outside, with the Prado mechanics.

    But..

    A few friends of mine drive Defenders, all shapes and sizes, 2.8, V8, TD5 & the new diesels & all the configurations - 90, 110 & 130. They have all had their vehicles for many years with MANY trouble free miles. Unreliable? No evidence of this. Mmmm, this made me think. I wonder how much of the 'reliability' issues can be contributed to driver stupidity (NOT saying Landy owners are stupid of course, I dont have stupid friends :-) ) either resulting from 'intoxication', ego, or errr well just being naturally stupid - and how many of the problems are true reliability conserns? I mean with thousands of defenders driving around dating back 30/40 years, there are bound to be hundreds/maybe thousands of lemons or abused vehicles and we all know that we hear more about things going wrong that when everything keeps right... but most ones (that i'm certainly familiar with) are fairly reliable. I am yet to hear of someone doing 60km/h on a backroad and break a drive shaft, blow a head, seize a motor etc.

    I took a new Puma for a teat drive this week and it feels unbreakable. Why all the bad press? Could it be a function of (driver stupidity) x (volume of older cars) x (issues with previous brand ownership)?

  2. #2
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    Defenders are unstopable!

    The problem with LR is that they are always the first to bring new technology to the field.

    They always have the most advanced electronics, drive systems, suspensions, etc, etc....

    These things will come with teething issues....Luckily Defender do not have these fancies!

    Also always new engines....they too will come with teething issues (exmpl. early Td5's, early Pumas, etc..)

    Once the one or two known issues are sorted it will be unstopable!
    Last edited by Regard; 2013/08/15 at 01:56 PM.

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    and don't forget, most of these awesome machines have well over 200k no more 300 000 km on them!!!

    and we put them through their paces every time we go away for a weekend!! so undoubtedly if you play hard, something gonna give some time or another
    My wife is simple, in a complicated way

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    [QUOTE=Boesman88;1800675I took a new Puma for a teat drive this week and it feels unbreakable. Why all the bad press? Could it be a function of (driver stupidity) x (volume of older cars) x (issues with previous brand ownership)?[/QUOTE]

    I think you have nailed it on the head - add to what you have mentioned the fact that the average Defender owner usually overloads it to a fairly substantial degree and is very 'economical' with proper maintenance (as opposed to servicing) of the vehicle.

    I have had 2 Defenders and neither has ever broken down or left me stranded somewhere. But I hate a overloaded vehicle and always maintained it to at least the manufacturer's requirements.

    I always joke and say that the 'best' vehicle in the world will be Defender built by Toyota...
    Regards,

    Nico Roets

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    Interesting read in the latest Leisure Wheels mag...............the compare the 3 x "real" (read solid axles) 4x4's with one another........

    The Defender........vs the Wrangler..........vs the GW..........8)

    But yes, we all know LW by now.........in here they also refer to the Rubicon as an overkill with its 3-locker system.........

    They rate everything........on / off road..........drive comfort.........etc. etc.

    Should have had the Cruiser there too........

    George
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    thats what you can expect from a Defender (or other 4x4) if you maintain it Well!!
    Last edited by D-tox; 2013/08/16 at 06:29 AM.
    D90
    D130

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    I think you need to look at the average age of these "breakdowns" You can still buy Defenders that's 50/40/30/20/10 years old, and if you look at the volume of these older models still availiable and being driven as daily drives vs your other brands then maybe the label should be the other way around.

    Garrie
    Defender 110 TD5 CSW 18P loving every moment driving it !!!!!
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    Reminded me of the Defender owner that had to admit to the Cruiser owner that his vehicle was the more unreliable of the two, and then realized that he's done 350 000 km of overlanding with his Defender and the Cruiser only did 50 000km to the mall.........

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    Quote Originally Posted by Miems View Post
    I think you need to look at the average age of these "breakdowns" You can still buy Defenders that's 50/40/30/20/10 years old, and if you look at the volume of these older models still availiable and being driven as daily drives vs your other brands then maybe the label should be the other way around.
    Exactly. To the uninitiated, all Land Rovers look similar because the body has changed so little over the years. I drive a 22 year old Land Rover 110 (note, it's not a Defender, they came later) and to most non-Landy people, it looks the same as a new Puma. So someone sees a Series III, or a 1980s 110 broken down, and they say "Land Rovers are unreliable" despite the fact that the SIII is 30 to 40 years old.

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    I think that the main issue is age.

    To the untrained eye, a 1957 Series 1 Land Rover could be mistaken for a 2013 Puma.

    To tel the difference between any of the coiled sprung vehicles from the mid '80s to present is even more difficult.

    Somebody who is in the market for a 2010 Hi-Lux/Ford/Mazda...whatever, will probably not consider a 1996 Hi-Lux/Ford/Mazda, because they differ too much in every way.

    The same is not true of a Defender, if they want a Defender they will consider any model within their budget, it is still a Defender, even if the newer ones are better in terms of refinement.

    So there are many old Defenders out there and when they break down, because of age, it is said that, "the Land Rover" broke down", not, "the 20year old Land Rover with 300000 hard km on the clock broke down.".

    If a 20yr old Hi-Lux/Ford/Mazda...whatever breaks down it can be clearly seen that it is old and it will be said that, "it broke down because it is old and it has worked hard".
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    To add to this...

    I am driving old reliable again now... because the Wrangler "failed to proceed"

    starter issue.... so it's stood at jeep...

    my 2 defenders give very little trouble - they are the cheapest vehicles that I have to run

    the gearbox on the 110 packed up a couple of months back... at 320 000km, cost ZAR10 000 to fix.

    the D90 threw a prop on Dewald a while back too...

    but mostly, the 90 sits in the front yard patiently waiting for when I need it... stands for 3 weeks, you get in it and it fires up instantly, every time...


    Tonight I will be attending the launch of the new 2014 Grand Cherokee at Jeep

    I'm taking the Defender 'cos my jeep has packed up!!! Funny!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Fontuin View Post
    Iif they want a Defender they will consider any model within their budget, it is still a Defender, even if the newer ones are better in terms of refinement.
    And fly to the other end of the country to go a fetch the "right" one, owning a Defender is a choice born from passion, the absolute resolution that no matter what, a Defender would be the only outcome.

    Garrie
    Defender 110 TD5 CSW 18P loving every moment driving it !!!!!
    Suzuki Jimny with custom made rack and drawers view here - Sold
    Stay away from negative people. They have a problem for every solution...

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    Most people only heard about broken Landrovers.
    If a land rover does break it becomes news headlines.
    On this forum we read about a few land rovers that was fetched by a insurance company. And in that time no other 4x4 broke down because surely they would have also posted if another brand broke down.

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    Quote Originally Posted by johnnybritz View Post
    Most people only heard about broken Landrovers.
    If a land rover does break it becomes news headlines.
    On this forum we read about a few land rovers that was fetched by a insurance company. And in that time no other 4x4 broke down because surely they would have also posted if another brand broke down.
    maybe thats because Defenders actually go offroad and the "most popular brand in the country" only ever goes to the mall?

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    Hoe verlang ek nou na my ser 2(2.25p) en ser 3(2.25p) en 110(2.5p) en Defender (Tdi),

    Did I ever break down ? Never!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    But I got de-moer in many times , the greatest thing about this vehicles they have a soul, AND I experienced the self healing properties that you only get with this the icon of 4x4
    Koos Best
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boesman88 View Post
    ... or so I thought. (dont stop reading just yet)

    Personally (IMHO), I think the Defender is the best looking 4x4 if you are into serious overlanding and offroading of course BUT oh dear, all the bad stories (IOHO) about reliability have made me steer well clear. Sometimes I wish my Prado had the Defender body on the outside, with the Prado mechanics.

    But..

    A few friends of mine drive Defenders, all shapes and sizes, 2.8, V8, TD5 & the new diesels & all the configurations - 90, 110 & 130. They have all had their vehicles for many years with MANY trouble free miles. Unreliable? No evidence of this. Mmmm, this made me think. I wonder how much of the 'reliability' issues can be contributed to driver stupidity (NOT saying Landy owners are stupid of course, I dont have stupid friends :-) ) either resulting from 'intoxication', ego, or errr well just being naturally stupid - and how many of the problems are true reliability conserns? I mean with thousands of defenders driving around dating back 30/40 years, there are bound to be hundreds/maybe thousands of lemons or abused vehicles and we all know that we hear more about things going wrong that when everything keeps right... but most ones (that i'm certainly familiar with) are fairly reliable. I am yet to hear of someone doing 60km/h on a backroad and break a drive shaft, blow a head, seize a motor etc.

    I took a new Puma for a teat drive this week and it feels unbreakable. Why all the bad press? Could it be a function of (driver stupidity) x (volume of older cars) x (issues with previous brand ownership)?

    All brands have problems, seen horror with the most "reliable" brands in the past not to mention cost and factory denial! Many more Landy's on the road than other manufactures, more Land's on the forum maybe?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    maybe thats because Defenders actually go offroad and the "most popular brand in the country" only ever goes to the mall?
    Thats a bit unfair. many people buy and use their 4x4s properly. Your statement could also be true for many D3 & D4 owners I suppose but that is not the point here

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    Quote Originally Posted by KOOS BEST View Post
    Hoe verlang ek nou na my ser 2(2.25p) en ser 3(2.25p) en 110(2.5p) en Defender (Tdi),

    Did I ever break down ? Never!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    But I got de-moer in many times , the greatest thing about this vehicles they have a soul, AND I experienced the self healing properties that you only get with this the icon of 4x4
    I have never owned a Landy, but I have owned some older generation Alfa Romeo's before .... And much about what is written here about landys (capability, soul, joy when riding it and of course getting de moer in) I can definately relate to :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Boesman88 View Post
    I have never owned a Landy, but I have owned some older generation Alfa Romeo's before .... And much about what is written here about landys (capability, soul, joy when riding it and of course getting de moer in) I can definately relate to :-)
    Wanted to say - you own an Alfa - it's a heart decision


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    Ek hou van Land Rovers ,maar ek hou nie daarvan dat TATA 'n vinger in die paai het nie. Dalk besluit hulle om TATA egines in die Landy's te sit?
    Toyota Fortuner V6 4x4 A/T

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