Expensive Lessons - Lets share the learnings





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  1. #1
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    Default Expensive Lessons - Lets share the learnings

    To all Disco 3 owners,

    I would like to share some learnings on the Disco 3 and invite others to post their own on this thread so that others DON'T have to pay the expensive lesson I am currently. I would also like to know while I am doing open heart surgery on my vehicle what else I should be renewing or looking for at 192,000km. [Perhaps if the comments here are good enough, this can become a sticky]

    First some background and update on my situation: my Disco 3 TDV6S (192,000km; 2005) is with its 3rd mechanic (Nekkies of Gateway Offroad, Wellington - referred by Peter aka Tgwinduna); Nekkies's team has just removed the engine and awaiting verdict from engineers on heads and block; cause: simple plastic Water Outlet Assembly split in two causing probable sudden water loss from engine; no temperature gauge warning, no coolant loss warning (difficult to explain why no warning: perhaps air vacuum, or temp gauge had not picked up increase in engine temp due to air in cooling system - guesses by mechanics); had simply lost some power pulling heavy load up Sir Lowry's pass, and pulled car off quickly; as I stopped the oil light came on, still no indication of over-heating at that stage, only diesel leak, but after inspection, no water in engine.

    Learnings so far:
    1. Change the water outlet assembly every 100,000km, or at least when doing cambelt (160,000km). Cost: part +/- R200, Labour: 1-2 hours, but only use guys who know this vehicle. Those who don't will tell you it is as big as the cambelt job. Saving: blown engine without warning - possibly up to R100k. Do it!
    2. When doing a major trip, spend more time in the vehicle section of the SA4x4Community, than on the trip reports of where you are going. Those learnings are more valuable than the best places to stay and see. If our breakdown had happened in Zambia or Malawi, I would probably be paying at least another R30k and suffering far greater inconvenience.
    3. Use a reputable Indy with lots of Land Rover knowledge. Avoid the dealers. Had the dealer cared or my general Indy known (who both had the opportunity to fix this problem), I would have avoided this situation.
    4. Don't just change the cruise control if it malfunctions. (Cost: +/- R2k for part and labour). Check the clock-spring and consider replacing that rather, that is if you really want the cruise control.
    5. When purchasing a vehicle do not rely on the dealer's 126 point check. Rather use the AA's. And more important: read up ahead of time on common faults on the forum and have those thoroughly inspected at the same time.

    Please add your comments. I am keen to learn from others too, and if possible, about things that I should be looking at now.

    Regards
    RSG
    Last edited by ReadySteadyGo; 2013/04/29 at 08:42 AM.
    Cape Town to Cape Maclear and back in 3 months (click here for trip reports)
    Vehicle knowledge is more important than trip knowledge imho (click here for expensive lessons)
    We will never be the same again.

    Jurgens XT140 Off-road trailer (sold)
    Land Rover Discovery 3 TDV6 S (2005) (sold)

  2. #2
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    Default

    can you show us a pic of the water outlet assembly, will have mine changed immediately.
    Die Hard
    "When all else fails, use brute strength & ignorance"
    2005 Disco 3. V8 SE
    1996 Disco 1. 3,9 V8 Manual (Sold)
    1994 Nissan Sani 3.0 V6 (Sadly Sold)
    2000 Lada Niva (was loads of fun)
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    2005 Scott road bike (work commuter)
    2011 Merida 120 (weekend MTB, sadly stolen)
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  3. #3
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    I know I don't have a D3, but the most expensive lesson I have learned was that it pays to listen to forum advice and phone Peter when you have Landy trouble. Don't go back to the same guys who ripped you off before and only on the third attempt go to Landyworx. Had I made the trip to Randburg the first time around I would have had an additional R14k so spend on upgrades instead of repair work.
    Defender 2.8i

    People talking without speaking
    People hearing without listening

  4. #4
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    RSG at least your vehicle is with the best Landy mechanic !

    My neighbour has a Range Rover. Over the last 10 years it has been with most of the known mechanics in the Northern Suburbs ..... let's just say if it needs attention we take the long road to Wellington.



    Expensive lessons - the "new" viscous fan was a dud (before taking it to Nekkies) .... cost him a very expensive complete engine overhaul ...
    Last edited by Elders; 2013/03/02 at 08:29 PM.

  5. #5
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    Default

    It cost me much less to have the outlet manifold changed, about an hours work, R300 part and some coolant, should be less than R1k in total.




    Quote Originally Posted by ReadySteadyGo View Post
    To all Disco 3 owners,

    I would like to share some learnings on the Disco 3 and invite others to post their own on this thread so that others DON'T have to pay the expensive lesson I am currently. I would also like to know while I am doing open heart surgery on my vehicle what else I should be renewing or looking for at 192,000km. [Perhaps if the comments here are good enough, this can become a sticky]

    First some background and update on my situation: my Disco 3 TDV6S (192,000km; 2005) is with its 3rd mechanic (Nekkies of Gateway Offroad, Wellington - referred by Peter aka Tgwinduna); Nekkies's team has just removed the engine and awaiting verdict from engineers on heads and block; cause: simple plastic Water Outlet Assembly split in two causing probable sudden water loss from engine; no temperature gauge warning, no coolant loss warning (difficult to explain why no warning: perhaps air vacuum, or temp gauge had not picked up increase in engine temp due to air in cooling system - guesses by mechanics); had simply lost some power pulling heavy load up Sir Lowry's pass, and pulled car off quickly; as I stopped the oil light came on, still no indication of over-heating at that stage, only diesel leak, but after inspection, no water in engine.

    Learnings so far:
    1. Change the water outlet assembly every 100,000km, or at least when doing cambelt (160,000km). Cost: part +/- R1.5k, Labour: R2-4k, depending what else you are doing. Saving: blown engine without warning - possibly up to R100k. Do it!
    2. When doing a major trip, spend more time in the vehicle section of the SA4x4Community, than on the trip reports of where you are going. Those learnings are more valuable than the best places to stay and see. If our breakdown had happened in Zambia or Malawi, I would probably be paying at least another R30k and suffering far greater inconvenience.
    3. Use a reputable Indy with lots of Land Rover knowledge. Avoid the dealers. Had the dealer cared or my general Indy known (who both had the opportunity to fix this problem), I would have avoided this situation.
    4. Don't just change the cruise control if it malfunctions. (Cost: +/- R2k for part and labour). Check the clock-spring and consider replacing that rather, that is if you really want the cruise control.
    5. When purchasing a vehicle do not rely on the dealer's 126 point check. Rather use the AA's. And more important: read up ahead of time on common faults on the forum and have those thoroughly inspected at the same time.

    Please add your comments. I am keen to learn from others too, and if possible, about things that I should be looking at now.

    Regards
    RSG

  6. #6
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    Default Water Manifold

    Hi RSG
    The water manifold to a disco 3 TDV6 is the same as a heater blank off to a disco2 TD5 two things that are mandatory. If a TD5 comes into the workshop and that mod has not been done then it is done automatically even if the vehicle only comes in for brakes or even light globes. As for a TDV6 if it comes in for a routine service and has low kilo's the water manifold is inspected for leaks, It does not just pop suddenly there are always tell tale signs of weeping and pink residue around the orifaces. Part of our CAM Belt service is a mandatory manifold change irrespective and replacement of coolant (antifreeze), ie full water flush and coolant replacement and then pressure test with emphasis around the water expansion tank and low water sensor early warning switch. according to a survey done in the USA quoted that 90% of all major engine failures is caused by coolant loss or inadequate antifreeze.

    Take Care

    http://www.overlandworx.com

    Take Care
    Stay frosty (Be alert at all times: We Live in a war zone)
    Peter Street
    0834535374

    2013 Disco 4 SDV6 HSE 8sp AKA " Gr8 White Induna"
    2019 Disco 5 TD6 HSE AKA Disco V





  7. #7
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    Don't drive a Landy without a sensor to measure sudden water loss.
    camelman
    '04 Discovery II Td5 GS (using 2SO)
    '95 Discovery I V8i Auto (Now sadly sold, with fond memories)
    Yesterday is history, tomorrow is mystery, today is a gift, that's why its called "present".

  8. #8
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    Injectors - Disco 3

    D3 started blowing white smoke at low speeds. Dealer investigation (very expensive injector leak test) indicates the injectors are overfueling and requires replacement.

    Received a tip from an indy (Levi from Mitsubishi Specialists) to add Wurth Injector Cure to 1/4 tank diesel to clean the injectors.

    Any ideas on this?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by camelman View Post
    Don't drive a Landy without a sensor to measure sudden water loss.
    Camelman, have you put such a sensor on your Disco's? If so, please give more details.
    Cape Town to Cape Maclear and back in 3 months (click here for trip reports)
    Vehicle knowledge is more important than trip knowledge imho (click here for expensive lessons)
    We will never be the same again.

    Jurgens XT140 Off-road trailer (sold)
    Land Rover Discovery 3 TDV6 S (2005) (sold)

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farla View Post
    Injectors - Disco 3

    D3 started blowing white smoke at low speeds. Dealer investigation (very expensive injector leak test) indicates the injectors are overfueling and requires replacement.

    Received a tip from an indy (Levi from Mitsubishi Specialists) to add Wurth Injector Cure to 1/4 tank diesel to clean the injectors.

    Any ideas on this?
    Take it to Peter at Landyworx without hesitation. Don't waste time with dealer investigations unless it is under warranty.... imho.
    Cape Town to Cape Maclear and back in 3 months (click here for trip reports)
    Vehicle knowledge is more important than trip knowledge imho (click here for expensive lessons)
    We will never be the same again.

    Jurgens XT140 Off-road trailer (sold)
    Land Rover Discovery 3 TDV6 S (2005) (sold)

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Die Hard View Post
    can you show us a pic of the water outlet assembly, will have mine changed immediately.
    Sorry, car is currently in open heart surgery mode in Wellington. Perhaps someone else can post a pic in the meantime.
    Cape Town to Cape Maclear and back in 3 months (click here for trip reports)
    Vehicle knowledge is more important than trip knowledge imho (click here for expensive lessons)
    We will never be the same again.

    Jurgens XT140 Off-road trailer (sold)
    Land Rover Discovery 3 TDV6 S (2005) (sold)

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by ReadySteadyGo View Post
    Camelman, have you put such a sensor on your Disco's? If so, please give more details.
    I have a simple Little Black Box (LBB) in my car which measures water and oil levels, temperature, etc. There are many more advanced systems available. Every Landy should have one.
    camelman
    '04 Discovery II Td5 GS (using 2SO)
    '95 Discovery I V8i Auto (Now sadly sold, with fond memories)
    Yesterday is history, tomorrow is mystery, today is a gift, that's why its called "present".

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by camelman View Post

    I have a simple Little Black Box (LBB) in my car which measures water and oil levels, temperature, etc. There are many more advanced systems available. Every Landy should have one.
    The LBB saved my bacon more than once on my td5. I've got a madman ems on the puma. Extra peace of mind.
    2009 Defender 110 puma SW
    2011 Freelander 2 SD4 (Swambo)
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    1966 Series 2a 88'' 2.25 petrol - ALFIE
    Ex:
    2010 Discovery 4 V8
    2007 Discovery 3 V8
    2008 Defender puma 110
    2003 Discovery 2 td5
    2000 Defender td5

  14. #14
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    Just as a matter of opinion

    Landyworx or LR Spares?
    Farla (Ferdi & Carla)
    2008 Disco 3 TDV6 HSE
    2003 Pajero 3.2 GLS SWB
    2005 Audi A3 1.8T

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Farla View Post
    Just as a matter of opinion

    Landyworx or LR Spares?
    Landyworx ( randburg) or LR Zone ( pretoria ).no question. Never used LR spares before.
    2009 Defender 110 puma SW
    2011 Freelander 2 SD4 (Swambo)
    1999 Defender 90 2.8i
    1966 Series 2a 88'' 2.25 petrol - ALFIE
    Ex:
    2010 Discovery 4 V8
    2007 Discovery 3 V8
    2008 Defender puma 110
    2003 Discovery 2 td5
    2000 Defender td5

  16. #16
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    @ TWINDUNA:
    "The water manifold to a disco 3 TDV6 is the same as a heater blank off to a disco2 TD5 two things that are mandatory. If a TD5 comes into the workshop and that mod has not been done then it is done automatically even if the vehicle only comes in for brakes or even light globes."

    What is this mod, and WHY ?
    Jan.
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    (Past drives)
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    2000 D2 TD5 White
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  17. #17
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    I think they are referring to this:

    http://www.landyonlineretail.co.za/s...category_id=36

    Look just below the turbo, you'll see/feel a plastic plug. This can start to leak. Replace it before it does.
    2004 Defender 110 Td5


  18. #18
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    RSG , hope you are back on the road quite soon. I thank you for starting this thread, it is so important to know your vehicle as mentioned.

    Also yes always take your vehicle to a Marque specialist not just any independent workshop, you need a specialist that knows the vehicle you drive like the palm of his hand.
    Like the guys mentioned, they know the right oils, whats needs to be checked etc etc, they just don't do a lube service they do much much more.

    Here is the pic, part # 1357091, it sits on top between the 2 x banks of the V6
    Attached Images Attached Images  
    Last edited by Koos Best; 2013/04/16 at 08:26 AM.
    Koos Best
    Land Rover Discovery3 TDV6 S.
    VW T5 D/cab 4 Motion with slide on camper

  19. #19
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    I bought one today (pics attached)

    Part number 1357091 Connection - Water

    Price R222.56 plus VAT

    I was quoted 1 hour labour plus Antifreeze to install
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version. 

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    Discovery 3 TDV6

    Admin removed

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by camelman View Post
    I have a simple Little Black Box (LBB) in my car which measures water and oil levels, temperature, etc. There are many more advanced systems available. Every Landy should have one.
    think the D3 comes standard with a water level sensor
    Defenders and disco 1 + 2 is a different story

    Land Rovers never die, they simply become organ donors!

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