Non landrover replacement engines in Td5





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  1. #1
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    Default Non landrover replacement engines in Td5

    Hi Guys ,
    we are running a fleet of TD5's on safaris in Botswana. I am looking for a replacement engine for the TD5. The engines are great but they not built for these conditions and we have 2 many problems with the electrics. Tdi would work perfectly but they do not have enough power as our vehicles carry heavy loads and pull big trailers so we need something gutsy to get through the sand especially in October . Any ideas maybe lexus or landrover V8 . A turbo diesel with a pump would be preferable .Please give me your advice .Road speed does not need to be over 80 kmph .

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  3. #2
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    the 2.5 TD Mazda engine and the 300tdi similar in power so would suggest the Lexus. it is a reasonably successful conversion

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    Quote Originally Posted by Landyluvver View Post
    it is a reasonably successful conversion
    That sounds fantastic

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    have had 2 defender Lexus conversions which had outboard pumps fitted
    both developed fuel supply problems
    fit LR in tank V8 pumps and problems gone.

    Land Rovers never die, they simply become organ donors!

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    LL I'm on my way down the Lexus road again as my 3.5 V8 has popped the head gaskets.
    A gasket set, lifters, followers and a new 3.9 cam with associated engineering will set me back an estimate R8,500 minimum, and then I'll still only have 100kW and 4-5km/L.

    I'd like any insights into the Lexus conversion that you might have. PM is fine.

    At the moment, the plan is:

    Lexus V8 and auto box, bench tested by Engines & More: R7500
    ChrisMod tcase adapter: probably using an LT230: R3000?
    14-inch thermo fan: still need to price this
    Spitronics ECU and TCU: around R6000 with Lexus harness kit

    I'll sell off the Rover V8 and LT85 (which is actually in good nick) to defray costs once the Lexus is tested and sorted.
    Last edited by jelo; 2012/05/06 at 11:01 AM. Reason: grammar
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    prices have come down quite a bit on the electronics
    the Spitronic setup can now be had for under R4k (incl gearbox harness)
    dyno testing to get a decent map is tedious and expensive
    have access to a map that works well which the guy charges R500 to download.

    Land Rovers never die, they simply become organ donors!

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    If you consider a Lexus conversion, just remeber that the 1UZ-FE is a hig rev engine that does not really have good low down torque. Consider the 2UZ-FE as it was designed for low reving high power applications.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cacti View Post
    If you consider a Lexus conversion, just remeber that the 1UZ-FE is a hig rev engine that does not really have good low down torque. Consider the 2UZ-FE as it was designed for low reving high power applications.
    Not really true, sorry. The 1UZ-FE generates over 250Nm straight off idle and peaks at 350-odd Nm. That's more torque off IDLE than my Rover V8 generates at PEAK.

    The Defender diffs and side shafts (especially the Rover front axle) are not known for being indestructible: that amount of torque is fine, and I'll look at playing with the AFR at low revs in 4L to avoid any off-idle flat spots.

    LL, that start-up map sounds like it's worth R500.....

    I'm NOT looking for a performance monster: my TCase and the rest of the drivetrain is 20-odd years old.

    I'll even consider a mild de-tune to around 170kW to avoid issues.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Not really true, sorry. The 1UZ-FE generates over 250Nm...
    Thanks for correcting me...

    I did however read on many other forums that the 2UZ is preferred above the 1UZ for 4x4 applications. As far as I remember the 2UZ also has a cast iron block to increase durability.

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    Absolutely, no worries Cacti......

    The 2UZ is brilliant, but is MUCH more rare, more expensive, and generates too MUCH torque for me.... 400Nm will break a stock Defender drivetrain in 30 seconds.

    I'm NOT a hill or rock climber: I want a more modern, cheap V8 that is reliable and can maybe rev a little: the 1UZ ticks all the boxes and can rev to 9000rpm using a Spitronics ECU. I'd limit mine to 6500RPM which is over 1000rpm more than the Rover V8.
    It is almost unbreakable if you service it occasionally and keep the inlet air clean. So the same as any V8.

    The Aisin auto box is bullet-proof and cheap as anything to replace (around R2500-R3000 for a used tested imported unit).

    The biggest issues for me at the moment:

    - radiator: can the stock Landy V8 radiator do the job or should I source a BMW 740i radiator? What about a 3-core tropical Silverton unit?
    - radiator fan: If I can get a Lexus with a visco fan, great, otherwise I need a 16-inch electric fan with a VW thermo switch
    - auto shift lever: no idea what to use
    - gearbox tunnel mods: Land Rover made the D90 with an auto for a special edition but these tunnels are not available. I'll have to bend some steel or 3mm ally for this.
    - sump: I need to see if I can get a V8 with the correct sump for the live axle.
    - WIRING: I'm a self-confessed electrical idiot. I'll have to spend some serious money for a good conversion sparky.
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    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    - WIRING: I'm a self-confessed electrical idiot. I'll have to spend some serious money for a good conversion sparky.
    Pick me! Pick me!
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    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    Absolutely, no worries Cacti......

    The 2UZ is brilliant, but is MUCH more rare, more expensive, and generates too MUCH torque for me.... 400Nm will break a stock Defender drivetrain in 30 seconds.

    I'm NOT a hill or rock climber: I want a more modern, cheap V8 that is reliable and can maybe rev a little: the 1UZ ticks all the boxes and can rev to 9000rpm using a Spitronics ECU. I'd limit mine to 6500RPM which is over 1000rpm more than the Rover V8.
    It is almost unbreakable if you service it occasionally and keep the inlet air clean. So the same as any V8.

    The Aisin auto box is bullet-proof and cheap as anything to replace (around R2500-R3000 for a used tested imported unit).

    The biggest issues for me at the moment:

    - radiator: can the stock Landy V8 radiator do the job or should I source a BMW 740i radiator? What about a 3-core tropical Silverton unit?
    - radiator fan: If I can get a Lexus with a visco fan, great, otherwise I need a 16-inch electric fan with a VW thermo switch
    - auto shift lever: no idea what to use
    - gearbox tunnel mods: Land Rover made the D90 with an auto for a special edition but these tunnels are not available. I'll have to bend some steel or 3mm ally for this.
    - sump: I need to see if I can get a V8 with the correct sump for the live axle.
    - WIRING: I'm a self-confessed electrical idiot. I'll have to spend some serious money for a good conversion sparky.
    Electric fan?? Nooooo! How is that fan gonna keep a 170kw-200kw engine cold?? Go with the hydrolic fan that Toyota uses. Just my 2CO...
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    British stock fibreglass tunnels for an autobox conversion in the Defender.

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    @Oom Paul: Ja jong, hoekom nie? I need a guy with electronics as a major subject.....jy's mos by Tukkies?

    @Marius Rautenbach: yes, from what I've read, I can remove the hydro pump, but I may as well keep the 2 stage stage and pump. But it is electronically controlled?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Landyluvver View Post
    the 2.5 TD Mazda engine and the 300tdi similar in power
    Any body done this conversion? I love the 2.5 Ford/Mazda engine,I think, with a bigger intercooler and some small mods it will outperform the 300tdi by far. Is a adapter plate kit available for this conversion?
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    Quote Originally Posted by jelo View Post
    @Marius Rautenbach: yes, from what I've read, I can remove the hydro pump, but I may as well keep the 2 stage stage and pump. But it is electronically controlled?
    Die hydro pomp werk saam power steering pomp. (EKS NIE HEELTEMAL SEKER NIE. HET LAAS DIT GESIEN OP MY OOM SE LANDY)
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    @Fanie Dup: fiberglass? in my Landy?

    OMDB

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    But I'll go to British and see if I can steal some photos.
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    We fitted a Lexus to swambo's dad's 90. We used a auto gear lever from a
    Cressida, works ok. A big electric fan keeps it cool enough , we fitted a BMW
    Radiator with oil cooler( connected the auto box to this). He is still planning to have his old 300tdi radiator recored, thicker and longer to make up the gap where the intercooler was.I couldn't find a fan to fit the motor as the hub wasn't the same as the local Toyota fans. We fitted a longer pipe with restrictor onto the power steering pump as it was turning the fluid into
    Strawberry milkshake.the props needs to be extended and shortened respectively.spitronics on engine and box, he is not yet happy with the settings, but it runs ok. LL changed the tc to a v8 disco's tc for him after the mod.he is currently happy with this.find a Lexus with the correct sump for the
    Front diff.his air filter setup it not yet sorted as he fitted a cone filter, this will keep rocks and doves out.this 90 is now fast( for a brick).
    Gents, a Toyota engine leaks just as much oil as LR.when you are getting a new exhaust system fitted make sure those okes understands 4x4 and axle movement, otherwise it will be ripped off by the diffs .all things considered , this wasn't very cheap, heard people doing conversions for 12k-15k?Where were they cutting corners and were these 2wd or 4wd?my friend's Lexus into a hilux was quoted @ R25k, but ended up R60k(I don't want to ask why)

  20. #19
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    MarcusD90:

    "We used a auto gear lever from a Cressida, works ok."
    Thanks for the tip!

    "A big electric fan keeps it cool enough , we fitted a BMW
    Radiator with oil cooler( connected the auto box to this). He is still planning to have his old 300tdi radiator recored, thicker and longer to make up the gap where the intercooler was.I couldn't find a fan to fit the motor as the hub wasn't the same as the local Toyota fans."
    Great stuff, a 740i radiator was what I was thinking anyway.

    " We fitted a longer pipe with restrictor onto the power steering pump as it was turning the fluid into Strawberry milkshake."
    Hmmm I'll have to see what happens here as well. Other guys haven't had this problem. I wonder if the 300TDi power steering pump is different to the V8?

    "the props needs to be extended and shortened respectively."
    Yes, fully expect some work there.

    "spitronics on engine and box, he is not yet happy with the settings, but it runs ok."
    The Spitronics software is extremely flexible. A closed loop system is almost mandatory.

    "LL changed the tc to a v8 disco's tc for him after the mod.he is currently happy with this."
    I'll consider this as well. I might source a loose LT230 for the conversion.


    "find a Lexus with the correct sump for the Front diff."
    Yes, but which one, front or rear bulge?

    "his air filter setup it not yet sorted as he fitted a cone filter, this will keep rocks and doves out."
    I'll keep a Donaldson type filter setup.

    "this 90 is now fast( for a brick)."
    Well 200kW is even more than the D90 2.8i version. I'll look at slotted and ventilated front disks and maybe a rear axle disk conversion.

    ".when you are getting a new exhaust system fitted make sure those okes understands 4x4 and axle movement, otherwise it will be ripped off by the diffs ."
    I only need to match the Lexus manifolds to my existing V8 system.

    "all things considered , this wasn't very cheap, heard people doing conversions for 12k-15k?Where were they cutting corners and were these 2wd or 4wd?my friend's Lexus into a hilux was quoted @ R25k, but ended up R60k(I don't want to ask why)"

    Because if you start with a 4 cyl diesel vehicle there are HUGE extra costs like a complete exhaust system, high pressure petrol fuel pumps and filters, bigger fuel tank, pipes for air filter, fuel, cooling etc etc.
    The condition of the imported Lexus V8 also impacts on the final costs: some guys REALLY sell you a pile of dog poo.


    My biggest costs are:

    - engine and box
    - ECU & TCU
    - high pressure fuel pump
    - transmission fluid radiator

    The prop shafts will cost around R2500 each for shortening, refurb and balance.
    Exhaust work will be R500 in Brits at Jake's Exhaust or Harties Exhaust and Tyre.
    The original fan, gear shift, etc etc I can source from the engine supplier.

    My import engine will be in good condition, all I need is a new cam belt and maybe a set of generic plugs.

    There are plenty of guys in Hermanstad and Pta West that sell generic stuff that is as good as the dealer items: hydraulic pipes, coolant pipes, fuel pipes, banjo connectors, fittings, engine mounts, thermostats, switches, etc etc.

    The guys that charge R60k for a conversion also factor in workshop labour @ a minimum of R350 per hour. It only takes a week of labour to add around R15,000 to your bill. Add a trip to an auto electrician and a couple of dyno runs......

    Yes, it's the small things that add cost, but the BIGGEST costs are the initial engine/box, ECU, and labour.
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    You can purchase the motor’s with oe Lexus management started before you take it.
    Personally I will use the oe motor and gearbox management instead of the aftermarket setup. Yes you can get more power out of the aftermarket ecu but the gearbox management isn’t ideal. With the oe management the gearbox will last a lot longer.
    The best part is that all the wiring is intact all you have to do is supply power to it.
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