How does one walk away from nearly 20 years of driving and owning Defenders




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  1. #1
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    Default How does one walk away from nearly 20 years of driving and owning Defenders

    First of all this isn't a rant, this is the school of Life, tongue in cheek, and something I want to help other Land Rover Defender lovers to understand before or when buying these lovely cars.
    How does one walk away from nearly 20 years of driving and owning Defenders, a 200, 300, V8 and the Latest Puma?
    Simple answer is you deal with the Dealers or Stealers as some like to call them.
    The complex answer is this and some of the things that come to mind are:
    • They don't honour Warrantees that everything is wear and Tear, Be sure to check the fine print on that extended Warrantee
    • Don't expect them to honours what they said the day before, get it in Black and White. When they offer "X" value for a trade in and it's good, take it on the spot Don't expect the same price you heard originally a day later.
    • Don't expect them to have even the Simplest of Parts (Exhaust gaskets for instance)
    • Don't expect your urgent repair to be attended to promptly, if it's in Warrantee because they while check to see what LR south Africa is paying out first and carry the balance of the cost over to you.
    • Don't expect a technician to try and fix a item, they will try convince you that it needs to be replaced with a new one. So when in doubt research the issue yourself and go armed with some suggestions. They love saying replace the Turbo
    • Don't expect the a perfect job on your landy when they "time box" every job, to help save cost. I'm lead to believe labour Rates paid out by LR South Africa are half the work shop rate. If you put 2 and 2 together, you now understand why out of maintenance plan repairs are so expensive, because you are helping to fund this.
    • Don't expect the brilliant picture painted by sales people, to be the same the service department of the dealership will give you.
    • Don't expect dealer service technicians to think you know the Car better then they don't because they drive your car every day not you!
    • Don't expect the Dealer to have all the special tools always, because they don't.
    What you should know about owning these Vehicles, or at least in my opinion
    • There is a Land Rover issued 36 page water ingress manual for the Defender, to help fix them or Like me fix it when it's new Less dust to compete with.
    • Make sure you know what Sikaflex or tectyle is,
    • Make sure you seal the Electronics are in the Newer machines, as the leak nicely, costly to replace
    • Oil seal issues have been fixed as per se on the Puma, but not entirely, so expect all of them to leak eventually.
    • The Turbo inlet and Exhaust manifold will eventually leak and will sound like your neighbours kid blowing on a blade of Grass, replace both, better yet, Buy a new triangular on for the Puma from the Chap in Germany, it may work properly.
    • The new Puma, Will cook you from below, if you don't use the Aircon in the Desert or in Sandton.
    • The old land rovers had more Under floor insulation, new ones have Paint only.
    • 200, 300 and V8 had Gear box oil coolers, to help cool the Gear box.
    • the Top left side Of the Rear door Will leak dust regardless of what we try do to stop it.
    • that you can find "Original" Lucas and Bosch parts faster (in 5 minutes with just a call or two) at a 1/4 the cost of the Dealer from LRCenter, Solihull, Leimer's, landroverspares.co.za etc,
    • That Aftermarket parts are the original parts without the R2300 box Attached (long story for another Day)
    • that heavy sand work will make your left leg burn, on the Hand break
    • expect that in wading you will get water in the Puma's doors, this is a why I think carpets are bad idea
    • Know that using Low range gear shift allot, Eventually the level will break and you will need to cut off the Pin, just reverse the direction, when putting in a new one, handed on two of my Car's
    • Fit a heavy duty clutch of you are going to be towing trailers a lot, you may get 50000 to 75000kms if lucky other wise
    • Put OME suspension on the vehicle and replace the steering damper
    • Do not put those lovely Stainless steel bolt kits on your Car, they cause a different type of Rust.. there is some fancy name
    • Expect on the older models from a cracking noise on the back door when the Spares Vibration cracks the Door Welds
    • Don't overload the roof rack if your Roof rack doesn't have supports to the A-pillar or rear Sub frame, you will bend the body work
    • Expect electrical problems and dead shorts, just look mostly by the fuses
    • Expect the Light Switches to stop working, if Only the bright work replace the short stalk, if they don't work at all replace the Long stalk
    • watch for Oil spots on the back door, of the Cars it will tell you, you will shortly have a oil seal issue
    • Find a reputable 3rd part mechanic, get to know them, make a friend and you will have a many happy visits to them, they will smile and you will rest assured your Vehicle will be in good hands.
    • Expect the front seals to go if you have driven lots in Botswana's muddy water or is that grinding Paste
    • watch for Flats on the tyres on both left and right side, this means your Bushes are going replace them with poly Bushes, they last loads longer
    • Replace the brake pads yourself, they are cheaper and take 15minutes max per tyre
    • expect loss of power sometime in the Car's life, I even had this with a V8, Fuel was evaporating in the ambient temperatures and the engine was starving newer Diesels is electronics issues.
    • Expect to bend a steering rod, if you don't have a bash pate when Doing loads of off road work
    • Expects Hot air, Dust and water leaks in /on the join between the centre floor box and the floor, Floor safe becomes a floor Over great for warming Pies.
    • Know that the only working Aircon is in the Puma, well sort off for the front seat anyways
    • Know that after they did away with the SA spec Galvanised Chassis, your Chassis will get surface rust, so PolyCell End rust, will be your best friend that dries Black
    • Know that there is no Under seal on the new models as on the older models, this helps to cheap people in Europe warm in winter and toasts us in Summer
    • Does Aluminium rust, or is that just poor paint preparation.
    • If you have a wet right foot, it's either because you are panicking or the A-pillar has water running down it.
    Lastly read all the forums and then decide if you still want to go through with the Land Rover experience, it's great fun, I have had mine, it's now time to sadly part ways.
    In all this I have never stood by the side of the road with a broken vehicle, and I used them for overland safaris. Sadly, I will miss all the fellow Owners greeting. I will still remember why we wave, "I'm alright you can continue"

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by krieglers View Post
    •What you should know about owning these Vehicles, or at least in my opinion
    [INDENT]• There is a Land Rover issued 36 page water ingress manual for the Defender, to help fix them or Like me fix it when it's new Less dust to compete with.
    • Make sure you know what Sikaflex or tectyle is,
    • Make sure you seal the Electronics are in the Newer machines, as the leak nicely, costly to replace
    • Oil seal issues have been fixed as per se on the Puma, but not entirely, so expect all of them to leak eventually.
    • The Turbo inlet and Exhaust manifold will eventually leak and will sound like your neighbours kid blowing on a blade of Grass, replace both, better yet, Buy a new triangular on for the Puma from the Chap in Germany, it may work properly.
    • The new Puma, Will cook you from below, if you don't use the Aircon in the Desert or in Sandton.
    • The old land rovers had more Under floor insulation, new ones have Paint only.
    • 200, 300 and V8 had Gear box oil coolers, to help cool the Gear box.
    • the Top left side Of the Rear door Will leak dust regardless of what we try do to stop it.
    • that you can find "Original" Lucas and Bosch parts faster (in 5 minutes with just a call or two) at a 1/4 the cost of the Dealer from LRCenter, Solihull, Leimer's, landroverspares.co.za etc,
    • That Aftermarket parts are the original parts without the R2300 box Attached (long story for another Day)
    • that heavy sand work will make your left leg burn, on the Hand break
    • expect that in wading you will get water in the Puma's doors, this is a why I think carpets are bad idea
    • Know that using Low range gear shift allot, Eventually the level will break and you will need to cut off the Pin, just reverse the direction, when putting in a new one, handed on two of my Car's
    • Fit a heavy duty clutch of you are going to be towing trailers a lot, you may get 50000 to 75000kms if lucky other wise
    • Put OME suspension on the vehicle and replace the steering damper
    • Do not put those lovely Stainless steel bolt kits on your Car, they cause a different type of Rust.. there is some fancy name
    • Expect on the older models from a cracking noise on the back door when the Spares Vibration cracks the Door Welds
    • Don't overload the roof rack if your Roof rack doesn't have supports to the A-pillar or rear Sub frame, you will bend the body work
    • Expect electrical problems and dead shorts, just look mostly by the fuses
    • Expect the Light Switches to stop working, if Only the bright work replace the short stalk, if they don't work at all replace the Long stalk
    • watch for Oil spots on the back door, of the Cars it will tell you, you will shortly have a oil seal issue
    • Find a reputable 3rd part mechanic, get to know them, make a friend and you will have a many happy visits to them, they will smile and you will rest assured your Vehicle will be in good hands.
    • Expect the front seals to go if you have driven lots in Botswana's muddy water or is that grinding Paste
    • watch for Flats on the tyres on both left and right side, this means your Bushes are going replace them with poly Bushes, they last loads longer
    • Replace the brake pads yourself, they are cheaper and take 15minutes max per tyre
    • expect loss of power sometime in the Car's life, I even had this with a V8, Fuel was evaporating in the ambient temperatures and the engine was starving newer Diesels is electronics issues.
    • Expect to bend a steering rod, if you don't have a bash pate when Doing loads of off road work
    • Expects Hot air, Dust and water leaks in /on the join between the centre floor box and the floor, Floor safe becomes a floor Over great for warming Pies.
    • Know that the only working Aircon is in the Puma, well sort off for the front seat anyways
    • Know that after they did away with the SA spec Galvanised Chassis, your Chassis will get surface rust, so PolyCell End rust, will be your best friend that dries Black
    • Know that there is no Under seal on the new models as on the older models, this helps to cheap people in Europe warm in winter and toasts us in Summer
    • Does Aluminium rust, or is that just poor paint preparation.
    • If you have a wet right foot, it's either because you are panicking or the A-pillar has water running down it.
    So what's the problem?

  3. #3
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    What are u going to drive now?
    Pajero GLS Exceed 2014 LWB &
    Jeep Cherokee 2001 2.5 Diesel, Gone to Jeep Heaven
    Toyota Hilux, plaas bakkie
    Platkar Swambo's MB

  4. #4
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    A Tjeep perhaps ?
    2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee V8 Overlander
    2014 Range Rover Evoque 2.2 D
    2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT




  5. #5
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    Probably getting a Pajero?
    2005 Mitsubishi Pajero SWB 3.2 DiD GLS (sold)
    2008 Mitsubishi Pajero LWB 3.2 DiDc GLS

  6. #6
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    I would have thought after 20 years of walking away from a landy you should be quite fit....
    I like anything with 4 or more wheels...

  7. #7
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    buy an Appliance and be ridiculed (spelling)
    Kia Picanto wif a sunrooff
    en Buell xb9sx Lightning aka Gatafval
    sold from under my .... Net n STD Isuzu KB300 D-Teq e/c plankie...

  8. #8
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    Default How does one walk away from nearly 20 years of driving and owning Defenders

    How does one walk away from nearly 20 years of driving and owning Defenders?


    Dunno, but try;
    1. Playing the Katrina & the Waves song 'Walking back to happiness'!
    2. Writing a book "Long walk to Freedom II"
    3. Screaming "FREEDOM" in a Mel Gibson BraveHeart type of way.
    4. Singing "Please release me, let me go".
    Surely you've walked away from your Defender many times, it just this time you are not returning with parts & tools...







    I'm only joking...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by krieglers View Post
    In all this I have never stood by the side of the road with a broken vehicle, and I used them for overland safaris.
    And that, to all the naysayers, is the key point in this post.

  10. #10
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    As plenty of Landy owners will tell you – you are only going to be walking away temporarily – you’ll be back.

    Several years ago I had to let my Series III go, until I got my Defender there was always a yearning to own a Land Rover again and not a single Landy will pass you without leaving a longing feeling.

    Sometimes when things go wrong a person reckons it is time to cut your losses and get something else – but then you can’t imagine life without the legend...

  11. #11
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    Nou wat de hel jy ken landys en al sy foute nou wil jy weer met n nuwe kopseer begin. Onthou geen voertuig is volmaak nie daar is nog nie so een gebou nie en nog n ding wat jy moet onthou n nuwe besem vee altyd mooi skoon vir n week of so. Hou by land rover punt.
    GP0019
    Discovery 1
    1996 JEEP XJ - Donated
    2000 HILUX D/C-Sold

  12. #12
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    Land Rover owners are special people. Not all people are special and therefore they should not buy Land Rovers
    camelman
    '04 Discovery II Td5 GS (using 2SO)
    '95 Discovery I V8i Auto (Now sadly sold, with fond memories)
    Yesterday is history, tomorrow is mystery, today is a gift, that's why its called "present".

  13. #13
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    You Guys are Classic, love the replies.

    "So whats the problem?" You Buy a Puma with and extended Warrantee and get an Awesome vehicle, the after sale service sucks, but you also need to take it to a RMI registered dealer to maintain the warrentee. For me Land Rover is just down the road, so I always take it their anyways, perhaps I'm a sucker for punishment, but my word is my honour, not the same at Land Rover dealerships. I'm also Tired of being able to source parts faster then the agents at a fraction of the cost. They just don't maintain Defenders like Disco's and alike, Like you're a second rate citizen. I've never had to do roadside repairs on my Landies except to replace a dirty Fuel filter on the V8, it collected bad Fuel in Zambia and fuel filter clogged. Or to Fix two flat in a day, using inner tubes.

    What am I driving next, My 26 year old trusty 2.0 Hilux Bakkie, and that still get service by Toyota and has no issue Ever. Only recently Did I start taking it to Allan Venter, (head gasket started leaking because of old age), who did a splendid Job. It's managed to do 34000km's between services NONE of my Land Rovers ever made it that Distance without having a Oil seal replaced. And at 351000km's it still doesn't have an oil leak, and the parts are cheap even Direct from Toyota. It's still on it's second clutch plate after 200000km's it still going strong, and I have had only the felt hub seals replaced.

    I did walk away from Land Rover and gave the TD5 a skip, but came back. This time though nope, I'll buy a Jimny or Land Cruiser 70 later, for now though, I take Ownership tomorrow of a VW... wait for it Bus... And you thought I would say Amarok. It's just family and Parents etc fit easier in the Bus. I did consider a Pajaro but, 7 seat is not enough for the family. A jeep is too small and/or not off road enough.

    Last thing I will buy will buy is a Fortuner. I did a 4x4 Course with Two Fortuners ahead of Me I got Bored with with Agony watching them scrap the Running boards every time they traversed a crevice or mound. Nice car though, but it's a car good for overlanding just little soft without mods.
    Last edited by krieglers; 2011/12/21 at 09:38 PM. Reason: spelling

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    You are going to feel bare and empty without your landy in the driveway. A landy keeps you busy and keeps life interesting, either with other landy lovers dicussing what you still want to do with your landy or what you already have done, and then the continued arguments with those other people,i think they call themselves jap supporters. you will be looseing your pie warmer and a cold pie is not so nice not even metioning your nice warm feet.

  15. #15
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    been trying for the last 8 years to keep my neighbours Range Rover on the road . and he spent twice what it is worth on it last year alone, and is now ready to cut it up for spares .... so the second part reads very true fro the brand.


    as for the first part of your post, dealing with the stealers. EQUALLY true for the suzuki and toyota stealers.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Weaver View Post
    So what's the problem?
    Part 2... Actually, this erks me too

    I'm Sick and Tired of Land Rover not coming to the Party with their Warrentee for one, always wear and tear you pay half...

    So I said to the wife (since she drives it most these days) lets sell it and buy a family Car. So My Wife goes to ask them, while going to ask them to fix a seal on the outlet manifold on the turbo, what the resale value is and what would they offer for it on Monday. They offered R196700, full retail on 2007 model (high / Low values on AutoBid are R207000 to R250000 or something,close to that).

    Come Wednesday they will not offer more then Trade at R175000 or so. I Could sell it out of hand for more, but that's a pain in the Butt, so VW offered R180000, even more then Land Rover. I'm tired of fighting the loosing Fight 6 times per year on a car with 5 year extended Warrentee, with R5800 minor services to boot. R6600 + for a major service. So whats the point of Buying a new Defender, My Landy has a service history for the past 4 years about 40 pages long, Of things I needed fixed and repaired. Means they are doing something wrong on a Vehicle that doesn't theoretically leak oil. Well, Till I noticed a leak on the Gearbox / transfer case connection, when checking why the handbrake was slipping.

    This is me whining..

  17. #17
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    My eBay watch list is going to look empty after I remove all the Land Rover Parts I've been watching, this is an unexpected bonus

  18. #18
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    I drive both a Landy and a VW, and love both, but I don't think you can expect a 100 percent improvement in terms of after sales, costs etc. If my DSG gearbox breaks down one day, eish I can most likely buy another Disco with the repair money.

  19. #19
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    [QUOTE=krieglers;996374]
    A jeep is too small and/or not off road enough.




    A Jeep may be a little small, but its plenty off road enough.
    -------------------------------------------------------

    Walter Kutcher
    Jeep Wrangler (2009)
    Ford Kuga 2.0 TDCI (2013)

  20. #20
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    "How does one walk away from nearly 20 years of driving and owning Defenders "

    You don't walk away........you run!
    Or you could always slip and slide away on the oil on your drive way
    Freedom, it's never free.

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